One year on - what has been achieved?

jimbjimb Posts: 861Member ✭✭
It's a year since Next-Gen was released - what has been achieved?
In my opinion just two things that are significant.
1) Sorting out the disastrous MyTV navigation
2) Hide and un-hide individual channels in the guide only

Is that it?
(Yes I know there have been other wonderful achievements like changes to the Information bar in MyTV.)

The phrase "glacial progress" has been used many times.
Precisely.

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Comments

  • Ian Brown1Ian Brown1 Posts: 38Member
    For what it's worth, my take on NextGen after a year is as follows. I didn't like the new interface when it arrived but now I am used to it and it serves me pretty well. I would even say I quite like it. I still wish I had the option to toggle to a list view rather than tile view on an occasional basis when list view would work better for what I was doing.

    Actually, I find my biggest bugbear these days is the many places in the screen navigation where the remote buttons would have an obvious function but where they do nothing. For example, if I am in the Guide and I hit the Info button to find out more about a programme, I wish I could hit the Play or Record button (with the obvious result) if I decide the programme is of interest. Instead the buttons do nothing.

    Ian
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    But pressing the info button in the guide does give the info.
  • Steve KSteve K Posts: 295Member
    Visionman said:
    But pressing the info button in the guide does give the info.
    Yep

    So does hitting the Play button give "the obvious result"

    Well at least on 29.27 they do.  What software version are you on Ian Brown?
  • skillerskiller Posts: 258Member
    I think what Ian is saying is that once you have pressed Info in the Guide to see the details of the programme, you cannot at that point press Play or Record; you must press Back or Info again to get back to the Guide before you can press Play or Record for that programme.
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    Action Panel...
  • skillerskiller Posts: 258Member
    Exactly. The functionality of the Action Panel hasn't fully returned yet. Mind you, it's been so long since I've used the OldGen Action Panel, that I can't remember if pressing the Play/Record remote buttons had any effect at that point, or if you just had to select the appropriate on-screen button from the vertical list on the left.

    Hopefully, when the full-fat Action Panel returns, the remote buttons will behave the same as the on-screen buttons.
  • RoyRoy Posts: 13,233Member ✭✭✭
    Keeps you up all night, worrying about this, doesn’t it?  :p
    ‘Does television exist for us to watch, or do we exist to watch television?’ - Noah Hawley
  • CegCeg Posts: 183Member
    skiller said:
    Exactly. The functionality of the Action Panel hasn't fully returned yet. Mind you, it's been so long since I've used the OldGen Action Panel, that I can't remember if pressing the Play/Record remote buttons had any effect at that point, or if you just had to select the appropriate on-screen button from the vertical list on the left.
    Pressing record or play after info on a programme in the guide does nothing on oldgen, as you said, you have to select the appropriate button from the buttons on the left.
  • jimbjimb Posts: 861Member ✭✭
    This link has been mentioned recently in another thread:
    https://support.youview.com/youview-box/software-updates/humax-software-update-27-45-0
    It's a software announcement and includes this:

    There are a few features that are not yet available, but rest assured they will be making their debut again soon:
    • Discover
    • Edit Channels
    • Action Panel

    It is dated 22nd February 2017.
    At that time YouView knew that they had quite a bit of work to do sorting out various problems with MyTV, yet the above announcement still confidently said "...making their debut again soon..."
    Soon does not mean in more than 9 months time.

    In May 2014 after YouView had secured a new funding deal there were press reports saying that:

    "...YouView has announced a “major” recruitment drive which will see its technology team expand by more than 50%.
    The service is looking to hire 50 new developers, test engineers and project managers over the next 12 months..."

    Did that happen?
    Is YouView's technology team still that sort of size?
    If so why have YouView not been able to restore these features within a reasonable time scale?
    It just doesn't make sense to me.

  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    Certainly its taken longer than we all expected, but after launching NextGen, they had a, how shall we say, quite negative reaction to the first version of it because, lets face it, the user journey was truly awful. But thats been fixed now and is pretty much perfect.
    So hopefully they are now back on track for their original mission statement.
    The ironic thing for me is that I don't and never have used any of the promised returned features.
    I'm actually waiting for the recordings 'jump to time' feature to return. But thats just me.
  • dreamtimedreamtime Posts: 112Member
    edited 4 December 2017, 9:10PM
    The 'dog' is still sleeping but you would of thought that the one man would be doing something.
  • RoyRoy Posts: 13,233Member ✭✭✭
    @jimb

    The ‘expansion’ in 2014 probably didn’t alter the number of people working on YouView, as it was just bringing in-house the development effort that was previously being very expensively provided by one of the big consultancies.

    So no quantum leap in the speed of development, then or later.

    Having said that, 50 is quite a decent team size, and one might hope that the proportion of actual developers in that number might be 50% or greater.

    I’m still bewildered by why the initial user journeys in NextGen were so awful, though; it seems to me it would have been no greater development effort to have got these right in the first place, and I wonder both how YouView’s design sense, in the dynamic if not the static sense, deserted them, and how come the developers ever consented to program these journeys.

    I suspect there was a fair amount of pushback that got ignored, followed by a fair number of screens whose screensaver said ‘See? I told you what would happen’.

    Anyway, I’ve pretty much stopped worrying whether NextGen will get to match OldGen before or after the Sagrada Familia gets finished, and just shrug my shoulders and fire up the FireStick. And pretty soon, I think, not having all of a channel’s back programming available on catchup is going to seem as absurd as when the BBC was wiping VT to reuse the tapes; so what price recording capability then?
    ‘Does television exist for us to watch, or do we exist to watch television?’ - Noah Hawley
  • RobertRobert Posts: 246Member ✭✭
    Visionman said:
    The ironic thing for me is that I don't and never have used any of the promised returned features.
    I'm actually waiting for the recordings 'jump to time' feature to return. But thats just me.
    I always found the Action Panel to be a useful tool but like many other people I'd dearly love to see the 'jump to time in the timebar' feature make a speedy return but I'm not holding out much hope for the 'speedy' part of that statement.
    Frequent browser....Infrequent poster!
  • CegCeg Posts: 183Member
    They're probably working on the backend ad targeting/personalisation stuff which, it increasingly looks like, was the whole purpose of this rushed upgrade. 
  • RobertRobert Posts: 246Member ✭✭
    Ceg said:
    They're probably working on the backend ad targeting/personalisation stuff which, it increasingly looks like, was the whole purpose of this rushed upgrade. 
    Widely speculated on at the time Next Gen appeared and of course they did remove our right to opt out of targeting. It's all about gathering usage statistics etc a la Windows to please the advertisers and other interested parties.
    Frequent browser....Infrequent poster!
  • RoyRoy Posts: 13,233Member ✭✭✭
    Robert said:
    Ceg said:
    They're probably working on the backend ad targeting/personalisation stuff which, it increasingly looks like, was the whole purpose of this rushed upgrade. 
    Widely speculated on at the time Next Gen appeared and of course they did remove our right to opt out of targeting. It's all about gathering usage statistics etc a la Windows to please the advertisers and other interested parties.
    I hope YouView are aware of, and preparing for, the new more stringent PII regime.
    ‘Does television exist for us to watch, or do we exist to watch television?’ - Noah Hawley
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    Ceg said:
    They're probably working on the backend ad targeting/personalisation stuff which, it increasingly looks like, was the whole purpose of this rushed upgrade. 
    Actually Ceg, thats part of the way Discover works, making personal recommendations, plus including 'push' content such as the most popular shows.
  • RoyRoy Posts: 13,233Member ✭✭✭
    edited 6 December 2017, 3:12PM
    @Visionman ;

    ITYM will work, if we ever get it.
    ‘Does television exist for us to watch, or do we exist to watch television?’ - Noah Hawley
  • JoeJoe Posts: 1,824Member ✭✭
    Next Gen works well for me. It’s had steady improvements as noted by Keith above...but there is still one basic area where it falls down for me and that’s Folders in MyTV. 

    Folders (or series recordings) work well with your standard series run, but when you record a long running series such as the repeats of Frasier, you can have a folder with 260 episodes. The sheer volume of episodes makes the folder a pain to navigate. 
    The sensible thing to do would be use the blueprint that YouView have in place for their search results, where season shortcuts are provided. The other thing would be for the last watched episode to be remembered ( just as it is with iPlayer/Netflix) and use that as the starting default tile.

    im surprised that basic navigation issue like this has not yet been addressed. Other then that I think the implementation of next Gen is really strong. I look forward to seeing how they bring back “DIscover” and the “action panels”.

    oh and don’t forget the apps! ...Amazon,YouTube, TalkTalk tv store, full Nowtv, plex 
  • jimbjimb Posts: 861Member ✭✭
    Visionman said:

    ... thats part of the way Discover works, making personal recommendations, plus including 'push' content such as the most popular shows.

    That isn't how Discover worked in first-gen @Visionman
    So are you speculating that this will happen with Discover in next-gen (if or when it returns). 
    Or do you know that this is what YouView are planning?

  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    edited 6 December 2017, 10:30PM
    jimb said:
    Visionman said:

    ... thats part of the way Discover works, making personal recommendations, plus including 'push' content such as the most popular shows.

    That isn't how Discover worked in first-gen.
    Didn't it? So how did it work?
  • jimbjimb Posts: 861Member ✭✭
    Visionman said:
    jimb said:

    That isn't how Discover worked in first-gen.
    Didn't it? So how did it work?
    Well like you I didn't use it.
    But what I recall is that it was a sophisticated kind of genre search.
    So you could work through a heirachy of categories.
    For example you could choose documentaries and then be offered a number of different kinds of documentaries.

    I've sent a carrier pigeon to someone who might be able to tell us more.
     ;) 
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    edited 6 December 2017, 11:11PM
    .
  • jimbjimb Posts: 861Member ✭✭
    Visionman said:
    But I did.
    So are you speculating that this will happen with Discover in next-gen (if or when it returns). 
    Or do you know that this is what YouView are planning?
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    jimb said:
    Visionman said:
    jimb said:

    That isn't how Discover worked in first-gen.
    Didn't it? So how did it work?
    Well like you I didn't use it.
    But I did.
  • jimbjimb Posts: 861Member ✭✭
    Visionman said:
    jimb said:
    Visionman said:
    jimb said:

    That isn't how Discover worked in first-gen.
    Didn't it? So how did it work?
    Well like you I didn't use it.
    But I did.

    In that case why did you ask me how it worked? 
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    I didn't. I was asking if you  knew how it worked.
  • jimbjimb Posts: 861Member ✭✭
    So that was just a diversion to avoid answering my question.
    Let's try again:

    Visionman said:

    ... thats part of the way Discover works, making personal recommendations, plus including 'push' content such as the most popular shows.

    Are you speculating that this will happen with Discover in next-gen (if or when it returns). 
    Or do you know that this is what YouView are planning?

  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    Your not going to let this go, are you? Because its me. Dog with a bone and all that.
    Fair enough, so I'll tell you, but nothing more after...
    I Beta tested Discover on first Gen, along with quite a few others, it worked, it launched.
    As to NextGen? Who knows?

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