[Discussion] BT software update 29.36.0

24

Comments

  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    Not at all. The update page clearly states which models are being updated.
  • jimbjimb Posts: 861Member ✭✭
    Visionman said:
    Not at all. The update page clearly states which models are being updated.
    Do you mean this update page?

  • RoyRoy Posts: 13,233Member ✭✭✭
    @jimb

    I think he means the conflicting one you get by choosing  Latest software versions from that page.
    ‘Does television exist for us to watch, or do we exist to watch television?’ - Noah Hawley
  • jimbjimb Posts: 861Member ✭✭
    Roy said:
    @jimb

    I think he means the conflicting one you get by choosing  Latest software versions from that page.
    Perhaps Roy, but...

    don't you think it would have been more helpful to clarify the situation when I first mentioned this 

    More importantly do we know if the T2110 is included or not.
    There's been no comment from Sarah or Phil to confirm this.
    Or are we just supposed to take Visionman's word for this?
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    Don't take my word for anything. I am just a user. 

  • Steve KSteve K Posts: 295Member
    Steve K said:

    Hoping this fixes Live Pause, will report back
    It didn't
  • RobertRobert Posts: 246Member ✭✭
    Frequent browser....Infrequent poster!
  • speedyritespeedyrite Posts: 52Member
    Roy said:
    Have you checked that your T2110 actually has the new release?  

    Yes, it's got 29.36
  • jimbjimb Posts: 861Member ✭✭
    Roy said:
    Have you checked that your T2110 actually has the new release?  

    Yes, it's got 29.36
    But that's simply not possible!
    Visionman said last night that "at the moment for BT sub (subscription) boxes only. The T2110 is a retail BT box."
    What's going on here?
  • RoyRoy Posts: 13,233Member ✭✭✭
    edited 30 November 2017, 8:48AM
    jimb said:
    Roy said:
    Have you checked that your T2110 actually has the new release?  

    Yes, it's got 29.36
    But that's simply not possible!
    Visionman said last night that "at the moment for BT sub (subscription) boxes only. The T2110 is a retail BT box."
    What's going on here?
    The irony has entered into your soul....

    But where is the 2210 in all this?
    ‘Does television exist for us to watch, or do we exist to watch television?’ - Noah Hawley
  • Philip TrottPhilip Trott Posts: 995Administrator admin
    edited 30 November 2017, 10:24AM
    Roy said:
    jimb said:
    Roy said:
    Have you checked that your T2110 actually has the new release?  
    Yes, it's got 29.36
    But that's simply not possible!
    Visionman said last night that "at the moment for BT sub (subscription) boxes only. The T2110 is a retail BT box."
    What's going on here?
    The irony has entered into your soul....

    But where is the 2210 in all this?
    Hi guys, thanks for spotting this - I've just checked again, BT are rolling out the software to BT subscription boxes only not retail just yet. I have amended the release information to reflect this, the T2110 will get the software at a later stage. Sorry for the confusion here! Phil
  • scottscott Posts: 1,634Member ✭✭
    edited 30 November 2017, 10:34AM
    Roy said:
    jimb said:
    Roy said:
    Have you checked that your T2110 actually has the new release?  
    Yes, it's got 29.36
    But that's simply not possible!
    Visionman said last night that "at the moment for BT sub (subscription) boxes only. The T2110 is a retail BT box."
    What's going on here?
    The irony has entered into your soul....

    But where is the 2210 in all this?
    Hi guys, thanks for spotting this - I've just checked again, BT are rolling out the software to BT subscription boxes only not retail just yet. I have amended the release information to reflect this, the T2110 will get the software at a later stage. Sorry for the confusion here! Phil
    You might want to update the Humax Retail T2000 on the software update list to show it is rolling out ;)
  • Roy said:
    jimb said:
    Roy said:
    Have you checked that your T2110 actually has the new release?  
    Yes, it's got 29.36
    But that's simply not possible!
    Visionman said last night that "at the moment for BT sub (subscription) boxes only. The T2110 is a retail BT box."
    What's going on here?
    The irony has entered into your soul....

    But where is the 2210 in all this?
    Hi guys, thanks for spotting this - I've just checked again, BT are rolling out the software to BT subscription boxes only not retail just yet. I have amended the release information to reflect this, the T2110 will get the software at a later stage. Sorry for the confusion here! Phil
    Awkward. My original comment about 29.36 in this thread was based on seeing that it was released for all BT models on the s/w versions page and hence gone public (there was also another thread here discussing something about BT releases getting ahead of Humax but that seems to have disappeared now). So I'm now probably in a spot of bother (which probably explains "something else"). But anyway, the inclusion of a fix for HDMI CEC was still news to me which is why I commented in the first place (and of course because it only half works for me as per my original comment). 
  • Nick7Nick7 Posts: 79Member
    scott said:
    Hmm strange because my Update players still fails with the same message

    Even their fixes are broken. What a joke.
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    Nick7 said:
    Even their fixes are broken. What a joke.
    I'm sure they love you too but the ironic thing about your comment is that there is actually nothing wrong, its just an incorrect message. But its the worst kind of bug to find for a test engineer to find - which is an intermittent one only affecting a minority number of users.

  • Nick7Nick7 Posts: 79Member
    Visionman said:
    Nick7 said:
    Even their fixes are broken. What a joke.
    I'm sure they love you too but the ironic thing about your comment is that there is actually nothing wrong, its just an incorrect message. But its the worst kind of bug to find for a test engineer to find - which is an intermittent one only affecting a minority number of users.

    Forum user Daniel managed to pick it up within 20 minutes of the discussion thread being opened. Maybe they should beta test them for a few weeks? 
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    Seriously, how do you know BT don't? 
  • DarrenDarren Posts: 189Member
    edited 1 December 2017, 9:34PM
    jonesh said:
    Keith said:
    If the BT T1000 boxes are to be left behind, abandoned :'(, it would be a pity if it happened before the functionality of the OldGen software is restored in NextGen.

    I still got an old BT T1000 Youview box that's about 3 years old and it still works 97% of the time. I now manly just use the T1000 box as a Freeview pvr and for the free catch up players plus Netflix. Seems to me that it looks like the older T1000 boxes are no longer being supported for new software updates. 
    I have been using the BT T2100 box for over a year now for BT TV as well as a Youview.
    Most other pvrs that I have used in the pasted seem to have given up the ghost after 18 months to just over 2 years.
    At times I seem to prefer the Netflix app on my Samsung full HD smart TV to the one on the Youview box but the Netflix app on the Youview box is good for the likes of my sister that still don't have a smart TV.

    Darren

  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    5 years they've been running with first gen tech. If they have been cut thats not bad and no other company would support such kit in the face of much newer models. Because they don't want you sticking with your old kit. They want you buying the new!
  • Steve KSteve K Posts: 295Member
    Visionman said:
    5 years they've been running with first gen tech. If they have been cut thats not bad and no other company would support such kit in the face of much newer models. Because they don't want you sticking with your old kit. They want you buying the new!
    Well to point out the obvious, Microsoft provide support for much much longer than that and I challenge you to find a company that sent out a compulsory software update that stripped functionality and then just abandoned the customers.
  • RoyRoy Posts: 13,233Member ✭✭✭
    edited 2 December 2017, 11:29AM
    Steve K said:
    Visionman said:
    5 years they've been running with first gen tech. If they have been cut thats not bad and no other company would support such kit in the face of much newer models. Because they don't want you sticking with your old kit. They want you buying the new!
    Well to point out the obvious, Microsoft provide support for much much longer than that and I challenge you to find a company that sent out a compulsory software update that stripped functionality and then just abandoned the customers.
    I suggest you check here, @Steve K.

    Drawing a veil over the fact that the equivalent to a five-year-old piece of hardware comes from a PC manufacturer, not an OS provider, you will anyway see that Microsoft’s lifecycle for an OS version is five years at the consumer level, and the further five years Extended Support you are probably thinking of is only available on a paid basis, and only to enterprise customers, and only provides security updates, not any new functionality.

    Think of the T1000 as analogous to Windows XP, and later devices as analogous to Windows 7-10, and this may bring things more sharply into focus.

    As regards YouView ‘just abandoning’ T1000 customers, I have seen nothing official regarding this, and at present it is just an extrapolation you make from the release they are currently stabilised on.

    But while Alexa may be a bridge too far for T1000s (and I stress this is only my conjecture, and I don’t know this for a fact), it would be a nonsense if they were abandoned before the full OldGen functionality, or at least its equivalent in NextGen, were returned to them, given that NextGen is supposed to sit so much more lightly on YouView boxes than OldGen did.
    ‘Does television exist for us to watch, or do we exist to watch television?’ - Noah Hawley
  • Steve KSteve K Posts: 295Member
    edited 2 December 2017, 12:00PM
    So Windows 7 first released in 2009 is still going to get security fixes through 2020 and has had no enforced functional degrades.  You sure you want to continue this sus line of comparative defence for YouView?

    And please provide evidence of any proactive advertising, YouView/BT posts here or indeed any customer contact programme for DTRT-1000 users to get their free new machine.  

    Because it rather looks more like they are just hoping most DTRT-1000 users will remain unaware and just naively believe that YouView are going to restore the functions to their boxes before the year is out.   Well what would you expect YouView to do when it's a £Mmulti programme to just change all those boxes and the accounts are looking a little cash shy?

    So here's a challenge to the official YouView members here:  give a date when BT DTRT-1000 users can expect to receive the equivalent of this 29.36 limited fix (either by new box or update)
  • RoyRoy Posts: 13,233Member ✭✭✭
    edited 3 December 2017, 7:25AM
    Steve K said:
    So Windows 7 first released in 2009 is still going to get security fixes through 2020 and has had no enforced functional degrades.  You sure you want to continue this sus line of comparative defence for YouView?

    Roy: I see you are back to whatever form of selective quotation supports your pre-established views  :# Do you not agree that there will have been no functional changes to Windows 7 after the first five years?

    And please provide evidence of any proactive advertising, YouView/BT posts here or indeed any customer contact programme for DTRT-1000 users to get their free new machine.  

    Roy: If anyone has asserted that there is such a thing, it was not me, and indeed the point is anyway not raised above. But let me rather turn the question round; are you, or do you know anyone who is, a current BT TV subscriber with a T1000 who has requested BT to provide them an update to a more recent box, and been refused?

    Because it rather looks more like they are just hoping most DTRT-1000 users will remain unaware and just naively believe that YouView are going to restore the functions to their boxes before the year is out.   Well what would you expect YouView to do when it's a £Mmulti programme to just change all those boxes and the accounts are looking a little cash shy?

    Roy: How many BT T1000 boxes do you think are still in use out there, Steve?

    So here's a challenge to the official YouView members here:  give a date when BT DTRT-1000 users can expect to receive the equivalent of this 29.36 limited fix (either by new box or update)

    Roy: I think you are making this challenge on the wrong forum, Steve; software rollouts to BT boxes are under BT’s control, not YouView’s, and it is not for YouView to provide such a date.
    But then I expect you perfectly well know that, and will not be issuing this ‘challenge’ where it properly belongs. Just as you perfectly well know that neither entity preannounces such things anyway.

    ‘Does television exist for us to watch, or do we exist to watch television?’ - Noah Hawley
  • Steve KSteve K Posts: 295Member
    Wasn't me that posted a false point (wasn't you either Roy), you seem upset that I refuted it.

    Only a fully paid up member of the YouView magical mystery tour would suppose that 29.36 was functionally superior to Old Gen so that comparison with Windows is false.  No one has the right to functional upgrades but similarly no one has the right to impose functional degrades just so they can have their mystery tour.

    As for numbers of DTRT-1000s then we know in 2013 there were ~ 400,000 YouView DTRT-1000 users so at worst there'd be something like 200,000 out there.  Say £50 cost of providing a replacement box and you're looking at £10M.   YouView haven't got that cash and frankly BT are unlikely to just ask "how would you like that, cheque or readies?"   So the 'hope they don't sue, lets keep them in the dark' strategy must have become tempting.  

    It's a problem and one of YouView's making.  You've suggested HTML5 should require less hardware resources that the previous (Flash iirc) design.  Well the evidence doesn't support that does it.  If anything it suggests that BT know anything beyond 27.50 uses up too many resources to allow the BT functions to work.
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 8,463Member ✭✭✭
    OK, this is reaching levels of paranoia even I've not seen before on the internet.

    "As for numbers of DTRT-1000s then we know in 2013 there were ~ 400,000 YouView DTRT-1000 users so at worst there'd be something like 200,000 out there.  Say £50 cost of providing a replacement box and you're looking at £10M."
    Why? You got a new one for free from BT. And you didn't even have to re-contract. Hypocrite.
    If YouView is truly the dogs poo-doo you say it is, you would have just left and and stuck with your Sky HD & Q boxes. But no. You choose to get a new one. [shakes head]
  • RoyRoy Posts: 13,233Member ✭✭✭
    edited 3 December 2017, 7:26AM
    Steve K said:
    Wasn't me that posted a false point (wasn't you either Roy), you seem upset that I refuted it.

    Roy: I don’t understand; what false point are we talking about here?

    Only a fully paid up member of the YouView magical mystery tour would suppose that 29.36 was functionally superior to Old Gen so that comparison with Windows is false.  No one has the right to functional upgrades but similarly no one has the right to impose functional degrades just so they can have their mystery tour.

    Roy: I think we need to separate the development lifetime of a T1000 from considerations of its final state. I would be vehemently opposed to that final state being any less functional than OldGen was when NextGen came in. I am relaxed about newer features being necessarily reserved for T2000s and up, especially if trying to shoehorn these into the T1000s slows down such development.

    As for numbers of DTRT-1000s then we know in 2013 there were ~ 400,000 YouView DTRT-1000 users so at worst there'd be something like 200,000 out there.  Say £50 cost of providing a replacement box and you're looking at £10M.   YouView haven't got that cash and frankly BT are unlikely to just ask "how would you like that, cheque or readies?"   So the 'hope they don't sue, lets keep them in the dark' strategy must have become tempting.  

    Roy: It’s different for BT. Leave a BT TV customer on an old box, and they are likely to quit. Loss of revenue for BT. Assuming your £50, that’s 10 months at the most before that customer becomes once again a net revenue provider for them.
    I have not seen any suggestion that YouView will be doing ‘new lamps for old’ like BT. As for anyone suing? T1000s stop working every day; there’s no comeback. Even the Richer Sounds 5 year warranty on mine has now expired. And a YouView box pegged at 27.50.0 is still better than one pegged out.  :p


    It's a problem and one of YouView's making.  You've suggested HTML5 should require less hardware resources that the previous (Flash iirc) design.  Well the evidence doesn't support that does it.  If anything it suggests that BT know anything beyond 27.50 uses up too many resources to allow the BT functions to work.

    Roy: You are saying it is a problem of YouView’s making that the BT functions overstress T1000s? If so - and it remains to be proved - then BT will remedy this for those who apply. Other users don’t need it.

    ‘Does television exist for us to watch, or do we exist to watch television?’ - Noah Hawley
  • Steve KSteve K Posts: 295Member
    Visionman said:
    OK, this is reaching levels of paranoia even I've not seen before on the internet.

    "As for numbers of DTRT-1000s then we know in 2013 there were ~ 400,000 YouView DTRT-1000 users so at worst there'd be something like 200,000 out there.  Say £50 cost of providing a replacement box and you're looking at £10M."
    Why? You got a new one for free from BT. And you didn't even have to re-contract. Hypocrite.
    If YouView is truly the dogs poo-doo you say it is, you would have just left and and stuck with your Sky HD & Q boxes. But no. You choose to get a new one. [shakes head]
    Oh look personal abuse and false accusations YET AGAIN

    I guess you don't want to understand that someone might want to have BOTH Sky and a YouView box with Old Gen functionality.  Or is it that you really hate being reminded about the farce your magical mystery tour became?

    Now to your next false point.  Just when did I describe Old Gen YouView as dog's doo doo?  Oh look I didn't.  And make no mistake I and many others are contractually entitled to have that back.  And I only contracted with BT again because YouView promised me it back.

    And your next one.  Yes I got a new box but as you know full well only because I contacted BT.    And what did I get?  A PVR with a busted live pause rewind function.

    Now I know that you hate anything that I post here so here's a top tip:  you don't post false stories like how lucky we are that YouView waited 5 years before degrading our boxes to force new buys and I won't post refuting them.  Deal?


  • Steve KSteve K Posts: 295Member
    Roy said:You are saying it is a problem of YouView’s making that the BT functions overstress T1000s? If so - and it remains to be proved - then BT will remedy this for those who apply. Other users don’t need it.

    Well ask yourself a few questions:

    - did Old Gen overstress T1000s?    Nope
    - do new generations of software techniques tend to come with increased demands on the platform?  Oh yes
    - did YouView or BT develop Next Gen?  YV
    - if something walks like a duck and quacks like a duck is it likely a duck?  Yes

    Now we don't know what the deal between YouView and BT was but it's hard to imagine that there wasn't an explicit or enforceable implied requirement that Next Gen supported BT functions on all BT supplied boxes.  

    So if I was BT I'd be getting more than a little tetchy with YouView right now






  • redchizredchiz Posts: 4,360Member ✭✭✭
    It's Saturday night for heaven's sake, do give it a rest.
  • joneshjonesh Posts: 1,097Member ✭✭
    redchiz said:
    It's Saturday night for heaven's sake, do give it a rest.
    Or take it outside. ;)
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