The base specifications require EITHER a built in wifi OR the ability to use a USB dongle. Neither facility is available on either the Humax or Huawei boxes.
In my case, the router appears to the box to be a standard ethernet connection and it is only the 5v power that I am using the USB socket for. Even the official Humax wifi USB dongle for their HDR Fox T2 will not work.
It says built-in wifi or a 802.11n or 802.11g adapter. Such as the one I'm using with my YouView box at this very moment.
p. 26
It ACTUALLY says:
"Devices shall support wireless networking, either using a built-in IEEE 802.11n adapter, or by supporting the configuration and use of optional USB IEEE 802.11g-compliant and IEEE 802.11n compliant adapters"
I note that powerline adapters have been added as an alternative after the base specification was first published.
None of the current boxes have a built in wifi adapter therefore they should be able to function with a USB - repeat USB - adapter. The USB sockets are currently only configured for use in firmware recovery (as described above). As I made clear, I am currently using a router configured as a wireless bridge (actually it is configured as a repeater but the effect is the same) which is wired to the ethernet socket, using power drawn from the USB socket. I could get the power from a mains adapter but this is a less neat solution for me.
If you are in fact using a USB wifi dongle, perhaps you would let us have the make and model number as I am sure several people will be interested. How did you manage to configure it without a suitable menu option?
I think people are forgetting (again) - that spec that everyone keeps quoting from is the specification from YouView to the hardware manufacturers. It has nothing to do with what the box delivers to us the users.
For all we know, the hardware may meet the specification. But if YouView chooses not to utilise that yet in their software, then we are simply out of luck.
It says built-in wifi or a 802.11n or 802.11g adapter. Such as the one I'm using with my YouView box at this very moment.
p. 26
Ah, I see. Well, the non-USB dongle uses the conventional Ethernet port for its data connection so it has a wire trailing from it as well as taking up the USB port for power alone, has to be sourced separately, and if you can't get it to work, then officially at least, you are on your own.
Whereas an official dongle, if there was one, would connect only to the USB port, could be sourced from the box maker, and if you couldn't get it to work, you could go to the maker's helpline.
But neither is as neat, for both considerations, as built-in, which would also guarantee you knew exactly what you were paying, up front, to have wifi capability.
‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
It says built-in wifi or a 802.11n or 802.11g adapter. Such as the one I'm using with my YouView box at this very moment.
p. 26
I see.
I have the Samsung wifi dongle, and I agree about the wires. The TP-Link has an advantage over the dongle, though, in that I can use it for other purposes.
It says built-in wifi or a 802.11n or 802.11g adapter. Such as the one I'm using with my YouView box at this very moment.
p. 26
For anyone prepared to be a bit techie if needed, the TP-Link probably would also have the advantage of cost. Sony Bluray players that were 'wifi ready' used to need a proprietary dongle costing £70, and perhaps still do; a TP-Link would be an attractive economic choice if YouView boxes also hammered it like that.
‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
It says built-in wifi or a 802.11n or 802.11g adapter. Such as the one I'm using with my YouView box at this very moment.
p. 26
Maybe a reason wireless wasn't included? YouView was already pretty expensive when it launched - maybe they left out integrated wireless to help keep the price down? Even another £ would have slid it over that £300 watershed.
I received my TalkTalk TV (Huawei DN370T) YouView box last week. It works fine! But I had hoped that the USB sockets would allow the use of a keyboard or mouse to control the box, i.e. to move around and select options.
I have a small Western Digital WD TV Live box which I sometimes use with a Logitech wireless keyboard (MK260 Wireless Combo, although the mouse is not supported by WD). The wireless receiver is plugged into one of the WD TV Live's USB sockets. This works fairly well, I can go around the menu's and select and view a BBC iPlayer programme online, for example. (This box does not give me ITVPlayer, 4OD or Demand 5, which is why I have the YouView box now!)
So TalkTalk, please can we have keyboard control via USB? That is what is meant by "human interface" in the YouView spec!
It would be good to have a mouse enabled too, as some TV boxes have (possibly ViewSonic?).
And of course, as per the YouView spec, the use of storage devices via USB! With HDD recorders my only recourse so far when wanting to archive a programme has been to use a SCART-to-USB device such as the ION Video2PC, and play the programme in realtime! It would be good to be able to archive programmes, even if this meant encrypting them so they couldn't be played on other devices, which could help to get round the licensing issues (I have an idea at least one HDD recorder uses this method).
I received my TalkTalk TV (Huawei DN370T) YouView box last week. It works fine! But I had hoped that the USB sockets would allow the use of a keyboard or mouse to control the box, i.e. to move around and select options.
I have a small Western Digital WD TV Live box which I sometimes use with a Logitech wireless keyboard (MK260 Wireless Combo, although the mouse is not supported by WD). The wireless receiver is plugged into one of the WD TV Live's USB sockets. This works fairly well, I can go around the menu's and select and view a BBC iPlayer programme online, for example. (This box does not give me ITVPlayer, 4OD or Demand 5, which is why I have the YouView box now!)
So TalkTalk, please can we have keyboard control via USB? That is what is meant by "human interface" in the YouView spec!
It would be good to have a mouse enabled too, as some TV boxes have (possibly ViewSonic?).
And of course, as per the YouView spec, the use of storage devices via USB! With HDD recorders my only recourse so far when wanting to archive a programme has been to use a SCART-to-USB device such as the ION Video2PC, and play the programme in realtime! It would be good to be able to archive programmes, even if this meant encrypting them so they couldn't be played on other devices, which could help to get round the licensing issues (I have an idea at least one HDD recorder uses this method).
Being able to use a real keyboard (so not just the current input method or even a simple on screen keyboard) has come up briefly a few times on the forum:
Correction, A revised base specification has been published which allows makers to omit built in wifi or USB dongle capability. A new separate paragraph adds the provision for homeplugs.
It says built-in wifi or a 802.11n or 802.11g adapter. Such as the one I'm using with my YouView box at this very moment.
p. 26
Not really, the firmware is not in place yet to provide either function. This is another case where the makers, particularly Humax, would be pleased to flog us one of their USB wifi dongles that are twice the price of the same gear without their own name printed on it. I suspect it would require "operating system" level programming and a slightly different requirement for each maker. YV are very keen to not allow makers to use the machine specific sub-menu that is also provided for.
Actually IIRC all Humax HD PVRs have been £299.95 at launch, only to reduce considerably once the minimum period to legally show discounts from that was over.
It says built-in wifi or a 802.11n or 802.11g adapter. Such as the one I'm using with my YouView box at this very moment.
p. 26
When the YouView development teams have the time to add WiFi and/or manufacturer menus, we'll let you know here. Both Humax and Huawei have done everything we've asked of them, and no-ones trying to stop device manufacturers - it's just not possible right now.
The original "At launch" base specification (page 24, table item 2.4 on peripheral devices) states that "Support for USB wireless Ethernet adapter" is a conditional requirement and is "Required for domestic connectivity if the IEEE 802.11n standard is not supported internally." https://industry.youview.com/resource...
There is nothing there that states it is not required if the maker specifies Powerline adapters as the means to access the web. At the grand launch with Sugar the options presented were built in or dongle with powerlines mentioned in passing that early boxes may come with them.
Nevertheless, are you now stating that this part of the base specification has been amended further to NOT require support for a USB wireless Ethernet adapter? Look, I realise that not all firmware will be in place when a model launches. The ability for the Humax HD Fox T2 to record to a USB hard drive was announced at its launch in Autumn 2009 but the last beta test version was only available at Christmas 2010. My point all along is that a FULL list of ALL features each MAKER wants to include in their boxes is vital for marketing, even if some are simply promised. The only USPs that BT and TT have is their extra content and the retail market is restricted to one model with two different hard disc sizes. No wonder so many box makers stopped being partners.
It says built-in wifi or a 802.11n or 802.11g adapter. Such as the one I'm using with my YouView box at this very moment.
p. 26
Yes Piers, I am aware of the recruiting drive for software staff. Your website is currently showing vacancies for a Senior Architect (Metadata), Head of Content Development, Project Manager for User Interface Development team, Lead Architect Consumer Device and an unspecified number of C++ developers.
So I do understand how stretched your development teams have been. I will again make the point that the time spent having them faff about with "copy Sky" remote apps could have been better employed implementing the elements in the base specification that were not available at launch and still are not.
Powerlines aren't 802.11n, which is a wifi standard, as they aren't wifi. Powerlines, logistically, are just equivalent to the deployment of an Ethernet cable
There's nothing about Powerlines that would allow them to fulfil or substitute for the stated 802.11n wireless requirement.
‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
I received my TalkTalk TV (Huawei DN370T) YouView box last week. It works fine! But I had hoped that the USB sockets would allow the use of a keyboard or mouse to control the box, i.e. to move around and select options.
I have a small Western Digital WD TV Live box which I sometimes use with a Logitech wireless keyboard (MK260 Wireless Combo, although the mouse is not supported by WD). The wireless receiver is plugged into one of the WD TV Live's USB sockets. This works fairly well, I can go around the menu's and select and view a BBC iPlayer programme online, for example. (This box does not give me ITVPlayer, 4OD or Demand 5, which is why I have the YouView box now!)
So TalkTalk, please can we have keyboard control via USB? That is what is meant by "human interface" in the YouView spec!
It would be good to have a mouse enabled too, as some TV boxes have (possibly ViewSonic?).
And of course, as per the YouView spec, the use of storage devices via USB! With HDD recorders my only recourse so far when wanting to archive a programme has been to use a SCART-to-USB device such as the ION Video2PC, and play the programme in realtime! It would be good to be able to archive programmes, even if this meant encrypting them so they couldn't be played on other devices, which could help to get round the licensing issues (I have an idea at least one HDD recorder uses this method).
Thanks, TrevorH
Playback from a USB device (subject to the files complying with the stated formats) is a required part of the YV base specification. Recording to an external USB device (or archiving as most people call it) is "Not required". I take that as also meaning "not forbidden" but it would be up to individual makers to implement it - hence my reference to the machine specific sub menus that are also allowed in the specs.
The use of the USB sockets for alternative input devices like keyboards arguably comes directly under the "Accessibility" requirements. Do remember that the boxes use a version of a non-Windows operating system so it might not be as simple as getting any USB keyboard. Some may require special drivers for things like multimedia keys that could not be accommodated by the YV firmware.
The ability to use a large (1Tb) USB hard drive would be useful for recording and playback. I wouldn't mind if Youview encrypted the entire content either. Would also be nice to be able to view photos (JPG format) on the telly via a USB stick.
The ability to use a large (1Tb) USB hard drive would be useful for recording and playback. I wouldn't mind if Youview encrypted the entire content either. Would also be nice to be able to view photos (JPG format) on the telly via a USB stick.
Totally agree about extending HDD size. I use the front USB to charge my ipod at the moment and this would be the only use I would have for the rear one.
Comments
In my case, the router appears to the box to be a standard ethernet connection and it is only the 5v power that I am using the USB socket for. Even the official Humax wifi USB dongle for their HDR Fox T2 will not work.
p. 26
"Devices shall support wireless networking, either using a built-in IEEE 802.11n adapter, or by supporting the configuration and use of optional USB IEEE 802.11g-compliant and IEEE 802.11n compliant adapters"
I note that powerline adapters have been added as an alternative after the base specification was first published.
None of the current boxes have a built in wifi adapter therefore they should be able to function with a USB - repeat USB - adapter. The USB sockets are currently only configured for use in firmware recovery (as described above). As I made clear, I am currently using a router configured as a wireless bridge (actually it is configured as a repeater but the effect is the same) which is wired to the ethernet socket, using power drawn from the USB socket. I could get the power from a mains adapter but this is a less neat solution for me.
If you are in fact using a USB wifi dongle, perhaps you would let us have the make and model number as I am sure several people will be interested. How did you manage to configure it without a suitable menu option?
For all we know, the hardware may meet the specification. But if YouView chooses not to utilise that yet in their software, then we are simply out of luck.
Whereas an official dongle, if there was one, would connect only to the USB port, could be sourced from the box maker, and if you couldn't get it to work, you could go to the maker's helpline.
But neither is as neat, for both considerations, as built-in, which would also guarantee you knew exactly what you were paying, up front, to have wifi capability.
I have the Samsung wifi dongle, and I agree about the wires. The TP-Link has an advantage over the dongle, though, in that I can use it for other purposes.
But yes, built-in wifi would be best.
I have a small Western Digital WD TV Live box which I sometimes use with a Logitech wireless keyboard (MK260 Wireless Combo, although the mouse is not supported by WD). The wireless receiver is plugged into one of the WD TV Live's USB sockets. This works fairly well, I can go around the menu's and select and view a BBC iPlayer programme online, for example. (This box does not give me ITVPlayer, 4OD or Demand 5, which is why I have the YouView box now!)
So TalkTalk, please can we have keyboard control via USB? That is what is meant by "human interface" in the YouView spec!
It would be good to have a mouse enabled too, as some TV boxes have (possibly ViewSonic?).
And of course, as per the YouView spec, the use of storage devices via USB! With HDD recorders my only recourse so far when wanting to archive a programme has been to use a SCART-to-USB device such as the ION Video2PC, and play the programme in realtime! It would be good to be able to archive programmes, even if this meant encrypting them so they couldn't be played on other devices, which could help to get round the licensing issues (I have an idea at least one HDD recorder uses this method).
Thanks,
TrevorH
- some have comment about remotes with a full keyboard on the rear
- others have commented on USB wireless keyboards
- and others still have noted that as the mobile app develops it may support remote control and then one could use the mobile device full keyboard and again here.
I've added the idea of being able to connect a keyboard via the USB port as item 99 in the consolidated list of improvements and feature requestsActually IIRC all Humax HD PVRs have been £299.95 at launch, only to reduce considerably once the minimum period to legally show discounts from that was over.
802.11n standard is not supported internally." https://industry.youview.com/resource...
There is nothing there that states it is not required if the maker specifies Powerline adapters as the means to access the web. At the grand launch with Sugar the options presented were built in or dongle with powerlines mentioned in passing that early boxes may come with them.
Nevertheless, are you now stating that this part of the base specification has been amended further to NOT require support for a USB wireless Ethernet adapter? Look, I realise that not all firmware will be in place when a model launches. The ability for the Humax HD Fox T2 to record to a USB hard drive was announced at its launch in Autumn 2009 but the last beta test version was only available at Christmas 2010. My point all along is that a FULL list of ALL features each MAKER wants to include in their boxes is vital for marketing, even if some are simply promised. The only USPs that BT and TT have is their extra content and the retail market is restricted to one model with two different hard disc sizes. No wonder so many box makers stopped being partners.
I use an old Logitech Wii keyboard with my Smart TV. Works a treat.
So I do understand how stretched your development teams have been. I will again make the point that the time spent having them faff about with "copy Sky" remote apps could have been better employed implementing the elements in the base specification that were not available at launch and still are not.
There's nothing about Powerlines that would allow them to fulfil or substitute for the stated 802.11n wireless requirement.
Saints preserve us.....
The use of the USB sockets for alternative input devices like keyboards arguably comes directly under the "Accessibility" requirements. Do remember that the boxes use a version of a non-Windows operating system so it might not be as simple as getting any USB keyboard. Some may require special drivers for things like multimedia keys that could not be accommodated by the YV firmware.