Channel 5 accurate recording

124

Comments

  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 9,511Member ✭✭✭
    edited 10 March 2017, 12:54AM
    Well well well...

    I don't often record CH5, but tonight I recorded the film 'Day Breakers'. So I did the usual 'record film', 'record break for news', and 'record film again'. But I didn't need to. As the AR was perfect on my BTV box (which uses the same YouView EPG).

    I'm impressed.
  • drhowellsdrhowells Posts: 634Member ✭✭
    edited 20 December 2016, 6:21PM
    Visionman said:

    Well well well...

    I don't often record CH5, but tonight I recorded the film 'Day Breakers'. So I did the usual 'record film', 'record break for news', and 'record film again'. But I didn't need to. As the AR was perfect on my BTV box (which uses the same YouView EPG).

    I'm impressed.

    Same happened to me the other day. I recorded the news in the middle of a film as well, but it all worked for me. Bit of a shame that we have to get excited and impressed when Channel 5 just get their system working :)

    Still not sure I fully trust it yet though. I will keep recording the news in the middle of films for the time being....
  • churchwardenchurchwarden Posts: 795Member
    edited 2 December 2016, 8:27PM

    Channel 5 now has accurate recording, has been working for a couple of weeks now. All programes I have recorded on 5 for that period have started on que. not sure if the same appies to 5 * or 5 usa

    My experience of recording Channel 5 over the past couple of weeks is that they have it cracked.
    No problems here image
  • David DrizenDavid Drizen Posts: 183Member
    edited 17 May 2013, 6:16PM
    Visionman said:

    Well well well...

    I don't often record CH5, but tonight I recorded the film 'Day Breakers'. So I did the usual 'record film', 'record break for news', and 'record film again'. But I didn't need to. As the AR was perfect on my BTV box (which uses the same YouView EPG).

    I'm impressed.

    5 now acurate recording however 5* & 5USA dose not, hopefully will do in the near future
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 9,511Member ✭✭✭
    edited 26 February 2017, 2:39PM
    Both Anaglypta and Piers previously confirmed CH5 didn't use AR. But I can only wonder if they've started using it now, with so many positive comments on the thread?
  • Michael6Michael6 Posts: 3Member
    edited 17 May 2013, 6:41PM
    After reading some of the above posts I set my PVR to record Neigbours.
    On viewing it back it had already started before the recording took place so I'm not convinced they are using AR.
  • churchwardenchurchwarden Posts: 795Member
    edited 4 May 2017, 12:39AM
    Hi Visionman

    Extract from Piers comment 6 months ago ...

    "All recordings on YouView are started and stopped by signals from the broadcasters (it's called "EIT Present/Following information"), and not from timers. YouView boxes and most Freeview+ boxes work in broadly the same way, and it's often referred to as Accurate Recording.

    .....

    C5 doesn't use the same method as the other public service broadcasters, but they do send the start/stop signals using EIT present/following. In the case of Bob recording Dirty Harry, C5 updated the schedule in advance which also meant that the EIT Present/Following information was sent at the new updated times, and the YouView box knew when to start and stop."

    Interpreting this I think you could paraphrase it as "C5 DOES use accurate recording, but their METHODOLOGY for providing it is perhaps less robust than the rest."

    I would think that Channel 5 have made their methodology more robust recently, or adopted the same methodology as the others.
  • KeithKeith Posts: 2,429Member, Champion mod
    edited 4 May 2017, 12:39AM
    If it were as simple as Channel 5 now having truly implemented an accurate real time accurate recording system then it would seem reasonable someone (from YouView etc) would confirm that on the forum (as it would close out this matter in relation to Channel 5). What seems more likely is that given the continued encouragement/pressure/engagement of YouView with Channel 5 that Channel 5 have made some changes to either more closely follow the published schedule or improve on the way they deliver the accurate recording signals that whilst not truly triggered by what is actually happening in real time more closely approximates it more often. One could even hypothesis that YouView may have offered some technical suggestions or advice to Channel 5 to improve their pseudo accurate recording signalling system to improve the situation at a cost that Channel 5 was prepared to pay (whereas a full implementation of truly accurate recording signalling might be something Channel 5 consider as beyond a reasonable cost at this point in time).
  • churchwardenchurchwarden Posts: 795Member
    edited 2 December 2016, 8:27PM
    Keith1 said:

    If it were as simple as Channel 5 now having truly implemented an accurate real time accurate recording system then it would seem reasonable someone (from YouView etc) would confirm that on the forum (as it would close out this matter in relation to Channel 5). What seems more likely is that given the continued encouragement/pressure/engagement of YouView with Channel 5 that Channel 5 have made some changes to either more closely follow the published schedule or improve on the way they deliver the accurate recording signals that whilst not truly triggered by what is actually happening in real time more closely approximates it more often. One could even hypothesis that YouView may have offered some technical suggestions or advice to Channel 5 to improve their pseudo accurate recording signalling system to improve the situation at a cost that Channel 5 was prepared to pay (whereas a full implementation of truly accurate recording signalling might be something Channel 5 consider as beyond a reasonable cost at this point in time).

    Sorry, Keith. Not sure what you are saying here.

    As Piers said "EIT Present/Following information" is often referred to as Accurate Recording, and Channel 5 were using that six months ago, according to Piers, how does that fit with your first paragraph?

    The rest of your post seems to paraphrase my last paragraph, I think.

    "I would think that Channel 5 have made their methodology more robust recently, or adopted the same methodology as the others."
  • churchwardenchurchwarden Posts: 795Member
    edited 4 May 2017, 12:39AM
    Sorry, Keith. Not sure what you are saying here.

    As Piers said "EIT Present/Following information" is often referred to as Accurate Recording, and Channel 5 were using that six months ago, according to Piers, how does that fit with your first paragraph?

    The rest of your post seems to paraphrase my last paragraph, I think.

    "I would think that Channel 5 have made their methodology more robust recently, or adopted the same methodology as the others."
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 9,511Member ✭✭✭
    edited 22 December 2016, 12:05AM
    Keith1 said:

    If it were as simple as Channel 5 now having truly implemented an accurate real time accurate recording system then it would seem reasonable someone (from YouView etc) would confirm that on the forum (as it would close out this matter in relation to Channel 5). What seems more likely is that given the continued encouragement/pressure/engagement of YouView with Channel 5 that Channel 5 have made some changes to either more closely follow the published schedule or improve on the way they deliver the accurate recording signals that whilst not truly triggered by what is actually happening in real time more closely approximates it more often. One could even hypothesis that YouView may have offered some technical suggestions or advice to Channel 5 to improve their pseudo accurate recording signalling system to improve the situation at a cost that Channel 5 was prepared to pay (whereas a full implementation of truly accurate recording signalling might be something Channel 5 consider as beyond a reasonable cost at this point in time).

    Superb post. And for you, unusually short, lol. Smiley

    And what you have said above was/is actually the crux of the matter. Cost. Because it costs money to maintain an accurate recording system. But it appears CH5 have now found what is to them an acceptable solution to the problem.

    Plus, being a content stakeholder in YouView, the last thing they would in this new venture is bad publicity (thankfully). As what they all want is for this to work and be successful.
  • gomezgomez Posts: 2,073Member ✭✭
    edited 17 May 2013, 7:37PM
    I will believe CH5 are using AR as it should be used when I see an early or late starting programme recorded with no clipping. As yet, all I have seen is recordings starting bang on the published time encompassing the start and finish of the programmes within the 4/5minute comfort zone offered by the ad breaks.
  • KeithKeith Posts: 2,429Member, Champion mod
    edited 4 March 2017, 10:29AM
    Hi churchwarden - yes much of my post above does broadly say the same as you, I must have been typing and thinking as you posted so did not see your post first (but was trying to keep it short as Visionman kindly notes ;-) ) :)

    Without actually having any detailed understanding of how the different channels produce their accurate recording signals/triggers it would seem that Channel 5 implemented the most basic system: trigger the signals with code that just knows about the published fixed schedule rather than being aware of what is actually on and when it is actually starting and ending. In contrast some other broadcasters might have a truly automated integrated logical system that ties in with their play out system and so the system triggers the signals automatically at the point the play out system switches to the next programme. Changing to a fully integrated automated system might be expensive depending on the current play out system the broadcaster has.

    One could speculate that Channel 5's top priority is not enabling the viewer to record its content solely with an accurate recording based system and instead their top priority is live broadcast viewing augmented with recording by the majority that can be made to work most of the time if slightly padded (which whilst not a great intelligent efficient solution can be pragmatic and practical in many cases).

    Nevertheless though Channel 5 do have some (moral if not contractual) obligation to YouView to improve matters and so may have decided (following discussion/engagement/pressure from YouView) to make a smaller compromise investment to improve their accurate recording trigger algorithm or schedule construction that to the end user gives better results whilst still not being a truly logical, automatic and accurate implementation of accurate recording signals.
  • RoyRoy Posts: 15,208Member ✭✭✭
    edited 6 March 2017, 10:48PM
    Keith & churchwarden

    'Accurate Recording' is a bit of a misnomer for the Present/Following EIT that all Freeview broadcasters are required to use.

    The 'Accurate' bit relates to the potential of the system to be one-second accurate if its capabilities are fully exploited.

    As they are by the BBC, at least, by what seems not to be an automatic system, but someone sitting in a darkened room with as many TVs as the BBC broadcast channels, and tweaking the EIT in real time according to exactly what's really happening.

    Channel 5, as you aver, just link the EITs to the timings in the EPG; so often, but not always, correct, depending on whether the programmes stick to the planned schedule or depart from it.

    Gomez has it right here.
    This is not the YouView that I knew  :'(
  • churchwardenchurchwarden Posts: 795Member
    edited 4 May 2017, 12:39AM
    Hi Keith, Visionman, Gomez and Roy!

    I think we all agree. The system is in place - it is how it is implemented...... and the accuracy of the result.

    It is clear that if you are going to try to implement the ultimate in accuracy, then there is a corresponding cost to provide this. The greater the accuracy - the greater the cost. Within those limitations, even if channel 5 are not using the more sophisticated systems of the others, my recent experience is that it has been quite accurate for me, and has recorded the whole programme, albeit with more padding than the other channels.

    Perhaps they are steering a mid-course (possibly as a result of dialogue with YouView on the subject, as a result of the complaints ....!) between accuracy and cost, until a more cost-effective automated implementation becomes available.

    For my part, on the very rare occasions when a programme has not recorded properly (I can honestly count those on the fingers of one hand....) I have found the backward EPG to be a real bonus of YouView. All-in-all, the more I use it, the more I like YouView, and now the skip has been fixed, I just await the further updates which are in the pipeline to really make it a nice bit of kit ....! Happy user.

    image
  • tracestraces Posts: 199Member
    edited 10 March 2017, 12:54AM
    Ending was clipped from New Justified on 5 USA 22nd May.
  • PiersPiers Posts: 561Member ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited 17 November 2015, 4:18PM
    traces said:

    Ending was clipped from New Justified on 5 USA 22nd May.

    5 USA and 5* channels are in the queue for Accurate Recording improvements. Likely to happen within 6 weeks.
  • gomezgomez Posts: 2,073Member ✭✭
    edited 23 May 2013, 8:56PM
    traces said:

    Ending was clipped from New Justified on 5 USA 22nd May.

    Is that an accurate assessment? ;)
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 9,511Member ✭✭✭
    edited 4 May 2017, 12:39AM
    Piers (Official Rep) 10 minutes ago
    5 USA and 5* channels are in the queue for Accurate Recording improvements. Likely to happen within 6 weeks.
    Smiley
  • PiersPiers Posts: 561Member ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited 17 November 2015, 4:18PM
    traces said:

    Ending was clipped from New Justified on 5 USA 22nd May.

    :) We're keeping our fingers crossed, but given the problems we've had with accurate recording over the last year, it wouldn't be wise to make promises until we've seen the results. Channel 5 and the YouView operations team have made some great progress over the last few weeks though.
  • drhowellsdrhowells Posts: 634Member ✭✭
    edited 20 December 2016, 6:21PM
    traces said:

    Ending was clipped from New Justified on 5 USA 22nd May.

    I actually made an audible groan when I read that gomez :)
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 9,511Member ✭✭✭
    edited 22 December 2016, 12:05AM
    traces said:

    Ending was clipped from New Justified on 5 USA 22nd May.

    Piers, gomez was having a joke with you. And drh, I actually giggled. Smiley
  • PiersPiers Posts: 561Member ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited 17 November 2015, 4:18PM
    traces said:

    Ending was clipped from New Justified on 5 USA 22nd May.

    I was laughing - hence the smiley. But I've got to keep up the "official rep" persona as I'm still on duty... :)
  • tracestraces Posts: 199Member
    edited 24 November 2016, 8:25PM
    traces said:

    Ending was clipped from New Justified on 5 USA 22nd May.

    Thanks Piers. YouView keeps getting better and better. So pleased i've got one.
  • edited 8 January 2015, 4:53PM
    Visionman said:

    Piers (Official Rep) 10 minutes ago
    5 USA and 5* channels are in the queue for Accurate Recording improvements. Likely to happen within 6 weeks.
    SmileySmiley
  • churchwardenchurchwarden Posts: 795Member
    edited 2 December 2016, 8:27PM
    Visionman said:

    Piers (Official Rep) 10 minutes ago
    5 USA and 5* channels are in the queue for Accurate Recording improvements. Likely to happen within 6 weeks.
    Smileyimage
  • RoyRoy Posts: 15,208Member ✭✭✭
    edited 7 December 2016, 8:38AM
    Visionman said:

    Piers (Official Rep) 10 minutes ago
    5 USA and 5* channels are in the queue for Accurate Recording improvements. Likely to happen within 6 weeks.
    SmileyGreat news! No longer will EPG on these channels be an acronym for Ending Probably Gone :-)
    This is not the YouView that I knew  :'(
  • Shaun EdwardsShaun Edwards Posts: 70Member
    edited 31 January 2015, 4:55PM
    Visionman said:

    Piers (Official Rep) 10 minutes ago
    5 USA and 5* channels are in the queue for Accurate Recording improvements. Likely to happen within 6 weeks.
    SmileyHi when I record Channel 5, the first 10 minutes at the start is missed. No accurate record here
  • Shaun EdwardsShaun Edwards Posts: 70Member
    edited 6 March 2017, 10:48PM
    Hi when I record Channel 5, the first 10 minutes at the start is missed. No accurate record here
  • RoyRoy Posts: 15,208Member ✭✭✭
    edited 7 December 2016, 8:38AM

    Hi when I record Channel 5, the first 10 minutes at the start is missed. No accurate record here

    There's still two weeks to the dudline.....
    This is not the YouView that I knew  :'(
Sign In or Register to comment.