Box reset itself and all recordings gone.

Neil DaviesNeil Davies Posts: 14Member
edited 30 June 2017, 1:47PM in Support
Today, my youview box locked up when changing channels. I had to turn it off and back on. When it then booted, it went through what seemed like an initial setup, then all the recordings were gone. I've now lost 3 months worth of recordings. What was becoming a very nice box is now useless to us. There's no way we can rely on this any more.
«1

Comments

  • edited 26 September 2013, 8:33AM
    Ouch, sounds a right PITA.

    Personally I wouldn't trust any PVR as a long term storage option for 'must see' content, they're not really designed for more than short term time shifting.

    But that said, I agree that the box should not wipe recordings after such a restart unless it's truly unavoidable.
  • MaxMax Posts: 75Member
    edited 30 June 2017, 1:47PM
    Hi Neil Davies, this is a known issue we are aware of and our technical teams are working on trying to resolve it. Thank you for bringing this to our attention.
  • alal Posts: 1,298Member ✭✭
    edited 5 March 2017, 2:28PM
    If this is a known problem, perhaps we should be told how to avoid it happening to us.
  • PiersPiers Posts: 561Member ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited 23 February 2017, 2:13PM
    Neil - I'm sorry that you've experienced this. Just to add to Max's reply, this problem is serious but occurs very rarely. It's not clear why it happens and we're working with Humax who are responsible for the software that formats the disk initially and detects any problems. We have hundreds of boxes in continual soak tests , and have only seen the problem once. We've asked Humax if recordings can be preserved if any errors are detected and the device needs to reset because it cannot start up correctly - they're working on a solution now.
  • Neil DaviesNeil Davies Posts: 14Member
    edited 19 November 2012, 8:56PM
    Thanks Piers and Max for the response, and I'm glad that a fix is being worked on. Our box is indeed a Humax box. In answer to Martin about using PVRs as storage, I'm afraid to say I have to disagree. We do use the PVR as a permanent store as I have done with our previous freesat box, with recordings going back years.

    So unfortunately for the time being, the Youview box has been left permanently in standby and the freesat box is back in operation. Once bitten twice shy, and we can't take the risk of losing everything again, no matter how rare or unlikely is is to happen.

    I'll be watching out for a fix to this, as other than this and waiting for a fix to the lack of menu's on a second TV via scart, the box is very good.
  • edited 26 September 2013, 8:33AM
    Hi Neil

    >> We do use the PVR as a permanent store as I have done with our previous freesat box, with recordings going back years.

    Then you have to accept the risks that doing so inherently brings.

    No PVR is designed as permanent storage, HD's fail and when they do data on them mostly becomes inaccessible, damaged or lost. One day your Freesat box will also die or suffer a mishap and when it does you'll lose the recordings stored on it.

    That's just the cold, technical reality.

    And if you still want to deny that PVRs aren't designed for permanent storage, the law isn't on your side:

    "A recording of a broadcast can be made in domestic premises for private and domestic use to enable it to be viewed or listened to at a more convenient time.

    This time-shifting exception does not however cover the making of recordings for placing in a collection for repeated viewing or listening. The making of a recording for purposes other than to time-shift a programme for your or your family is likely to be illegal.'


    http://www.ipo.gov.uk/types/copy/c-ot...
  • Sandy2Sandy2 Posts: 4Member
    edited 26 September 2013, 8:33AM
    Hi Martin

    I have exactly the same problem with my youview box yesterday (I have had it less than 2 weeks). When I turned it on, it took me through the initial set up and when I had finished setting up, all my recordings and schedule programmes had been lost!

    I have phoned youview this morning and they say they have not experienced this problem before and told me to reset the box.

    I asked how reliable the box is, as I have had a Sky+ box for years and never had this problem. They said it shouldn't happen again, but how can they be sure?
  • Sandy2Sandy2 Posts: 4Member
    edited 5 November 2015, 11:33AM
    I phoned youview back and told them that this problem has been experienced by other customers and they told me to send an email to: [email protected] to get a fix (which can be applied to the box via a usb stick). I will let you know how I get on!
  • edited 20 November 2012, 1:02PM
    Sandy2 said:

    Hi Martin

    I have exactly the same problem with my youview box yesterday (I have had it less than 2 weeks). When I turned it on, it took me through the initial set up and when I had finished setting up, all my recordings and schedule programmes had been lost!

    I have phoned youview this morning and they say they have not experienced this problem before and told me to reset the box.

    I asked how reliable the box is, as I have had a Sky+ box for years and never had this problem. They said it shouldn't happen again, but how can they be sure?

    Hi Sandy

    As I said in my first first post in this thread, it's a pain for something like this to happen.

    I wouldn't be pleased if it happened to me either but unlike Neil I don't use any PVR as a permanent or long-term storage for recordings because it's not what they're designed for and it's not safe to do so.

    That's not the same as suggesting it's fine for the box to wipe itself in this way.
  • MaxMax Posts: 75Member
    edited 5 November 2015, 11:33AM
    Sandy2 said:

    I phoned youview back and told them that this problem has been experienced by other customers and they told me to send an email to: [email protected] to get a fix (which can be applied to the box via a usb stick). I will let you know how I get on!

    Hi Sandy, The advice that the Viewer support team has given you is not quite correct, but, we will need to trouble shoot this further. Please only contact [email protected] if you are experiencing missing channels with your Humax box.
    In the meantime, I’ll arrange for one of the support team to be in contact with you so we can gather as much information as possible to assist with the ongoing Fix

    We apologize for the mis-information and any inconvenience that may have caused
  • KeithKeith Posts: 2,429Member, Champion mod
    edited 4 March 2017, 10:29AM
    I've now added this issue to the consolidated list of bugs and faults. That happens to make it item 13, clearly very unlucky for some :(
  • Sandy2Sandy2 Posts: 4Member
    edited 20 November 2012, 2:49PM
    Sandy2 said:

    Hi Martin

    I have exactly the same problem with my youview box yesterday (I have had it less than 2 weeks). When I turned it on, it took me through the initial set up and when I had finished setting up, all my recordings and schedule programmes had been lost!

    I have phoned youview this morning and they say they have not experienced this problem before and told me to reset the box.

    I asked how reliable the box is, as I have had a Sky+ box for years and never had this problem. They said it shouldn't happen again, but how can they be sure?

    Hi Martin
    I'm sure you will agree that wiping your recorded programmes after less than 2 weeks and all your scheduled recordings was neither 'long term' storage or acceptable
  • edited 20 November 2012, 2:52PM
    Sandy2 said:

    Hi Martin

    I have exactly the same problem with my youview box yesterday (I have had it less than 2 weeks). When I turned it on, it took me through the initial set up and when I had finished setting up, all my recordings and schedule programmes had been lost!

    I have phoned youview this morning and they say they have not experienced this problem before and told me to reset the box.

    I asked how reliable the box is, as I have had a Sky+ box for years and never had this problem. They said it shouldn't happen again, but how can they be sure?

    What part of

    "That's not the same as suggesting it's fine for the box to wipe itself in this way."

    did you choose to ignore in order to ask that question?
  • Neil DaviesNeil Davies Posts: 14Member
    edited 20 November 2012, 3:06PM
    Sandy2 said:

    Hi Martin

    I have exactly the same problem with my youview box yesterday (I have had it less than 2 weeks). When I turned it on, it took me through the initial set up and when I had finished setting up, all my recordings and schedule programmes had been lost!

    I have phoned youview this morning and they say they have not experienced this problem before and told me to reset the box.

    I asked how reliable the box is, as I have had a Sky+ box for years and never had this problem. They said it shouldn't happen again, but how can they be sure?

    I'd like to echo Sandy's thoughts here, and also, this thread shouldn't be about the reliability of storing programmes on hard drives. My have worked in computer repairs for over a decade (still do), so I'm aware how few hard drives fail (that have not be caused by user abuse). Storing on video tape or DVD's was a lot more unreliable.

    But to come back to the original post, the problem here is a software issue and is gratefully being looked into.

    As far as not storing long term (ie 3 months worth in my case) not being recommended, I think millions of Sky+, freesat and freeview users would dissagree.

    What we're keeping on our PVR there are not childhood or wedding videos, or other things of massive sentimental value. I've got many backups of these types of things in case of hard drive failures.

    I'm saying I've lost films, series of programmes, and other programmes we were going to watch when we had time. And there's kids programmes that my children ask for repeatedly, being creatures of habit.

    It's all unavoidable inconvienience that Vouview achknowledge is a problem and are planning on putting right.
  • edited 20 November 2012, 3:29PM
    Sandy2 said:

    Hi Martin

    I have exactly the same problem with my youview box yesterday (I have had it less than 2 weeks). When I turned it on, it took me through the initial set up and when I had finished setting up, all my recordings and schedule programmes had been lost!

    I have phoned youview this morning and they say they have not experienced this problem before and told me to reset the box.

    I asked how reliable the box is, as I have had a Sky+ box for years and never had this problem. They said it shouldn't happen again, but how can they be sure?

    >> As far as not storing long term (ie 3 months worth in my case) not being recommended, I think millions of Sky+, freesat and freeview users would dissagree.

    Users may well disagree, but the stark reality is these boxes have limited warranties and for a very good reason - they can and do go wrong and die.

    They're designed solely for time-shifting, not for building libraries of content, not least because its illegal under UK law to record TV content for repeated viewings and longterm storage.

    As for

    "this thread shouldn't be about the reliability of storing programmes on hard drives"

    It was you who first responded to a throwaway comment & you who has now responded to a branch of the discussion between Sandy and I.
  • Neil DaviesNeil Davies Posts: 14Member
    edited 20 November 2012, 3:53PM
    Sandy2 said:

    Hi Martin

    I have exactly the same problem with my youview box yesterday (I have had it less than 2 weeks). When I turned it on, it took me through the initial set up and when I had finished setting up, all my recordings and schedule programmes had been lost!

    I have phoned youview this morning and they say they have not experienced this problem before and told me to reset the box.

    I asked how reliable the box is, as I have had a Sky+ box for years and never had this problem. They said it shouldn't happen again, but how can they be sure?

    I can see this is getting you quite wound up Martin, and that wasn't my intention.

    I'll end by asking that we now act like grown ups, agree to dissagree, and allow this thread to stay on the original topic, which is the problem that Sandy and I have both experienced.

    I'm not going to reply any more to the storage debate, only to the Youview software problem. Feel free to have the last comment.
  • John6John6 Posts: 1Member
    edited 27 November 2012, 1:27PM
    This happen to me recently too. Lost about four months worth of recordings. Very annoying.

    The email response from Youview support after I'd phoned them was very generic and didn't really acknowledge that the box had reset itself, only that 'a reset had been performed' and that recordings could not be recovered after this.

    I'm now quite wary that this could happen again at any time.
  • Neil DaviesNeil Davies Posts: 14Member
    edited 27 November 2012, 10:19PM
    John said "I'm now quite wary that this could happen again at any time. "

    Same for me, I can't trust this to not happen again, and we're now back to using our old freesat box until the fix for this is released.
  • Steve RobertsSteve Roberts Posts: 3Member
    edited 28 November 2012, 8:45PM
    Happened to us after six days. Just turned it on and it completely reset
  • Neil DaviesNeil Davies Posts: 14Member
    edited 28 November 2012, 10:42PM
    It seems this is getting to be a more popular problem now it's been highlighted.
  • Darran GilpinDarran Gilpin Posts: 1Member
    edited 9 December 2012, 9:44PM
    Happened to me as well after only a few weeks of having it. Shambles.
  • Lbear2Lbear2 Posts: 55Member
    edited 9 December 2012, 10:06PM
    yesterday I turned my box on after a few days illness to be asked to retune. Watched a little, went back to bed and turning on found it stuck in a restart loop. Turned mains switch on back off and on to find it had updated and had deleted all recordings and reset to factory settings so could not have used the tv's internal tuner as no loop through. Appears this is all for the sake of an iPhone app I cannot use. Thanks Youview -seen the sales figures for the two mobile OSs recently?
  • Lbear2Lbear2 Posts: 55Member
    edited 9 December 2012, 10:10PM
    just seen the comment about not retaining more than 3 months.It is a good idea IF Youview had provided the promised archive to USB drive ability!
  • edited 26 September 2013, 8:33AM
    Turned mains switch on back off and on to find it had updated and had deleted all recordings and reset to factory settings

    Resetting to factory settings and deleting recordings isn't a normal part of the software update process, sounds like something went wrong in your case.
  • Lbear2Lbear2 Posts: 55Member
    edited 9 December 2012, 11:51PM
    Martin1 said:

    Turned mains switch on back off and on to find it had updated and had deleted all recordings and reset to factory settings

    Resetting to factory settings and deleting recordings isn't a normal part of the software update process, sounds like something went wrong in your case.

    Yes, Humax/Youview has not issued the USB archive software. I am a triallist with experience of Humax boxes and a decent knowledge of the principles. These boxes are designed to be usable by the "mum on the 14th floor" to use Sugar's target description.

    Failed updates should not crash the boxes or if the do, should not delete recordings detected on the hard drive. Equally the software should have a "hidden menu" that can be accessed in these circumstances so the box can reinstate the recordings that will still be on the hard drive but are just marked as deleted until the space is freed for overwriting.
  • Lbear2Lbear2 Posts: 55Member
    edited 10 December 2012, 3:24AM
    Piers2 said:

    Neil - I'm sorry that you've experienced this. Just to add to Max's reply, this problem is serious but occurs very rarely. It's not clear why it happens and we're working with Humax who are responsible for the software that formats the disk initially and detects any problems. We have hundreds of boxes in continual soak tests , and have only seen the problem once. We've asked Humax if recordings can be preserved if any errors are detected and the device needs to reset because it cannot start up correctly - they're working on a solution now.

    Sorry to be aggressive but the answer appears to be the probably quite simple matter of directing the crash recovery to the "reset without deleting" routine that is now on the box

    I also strongly suspect that is a misnomer, rather than reformatting the entire hard disc, the recordings may still be on there until overwritten but not accessed by the usual software - much in the same way that Windows does. Surely, like Windows, Linux has "undelete" routines that could, at the least, be provided to tech savvy people with this problem to use, via a USB stick install, to run?

    That routine in itself would be very useful anyway as it is now quite easy to accidentally delete a recording now that there is no confirm needed. Too long a press on the delete button, if the box is in a grumpy mood, can result in two rather than one recording being wiped.
  • Lbear2Lbear2 Posts: 55Member
    edited 10 December 2012, 3:25AM
    al said:

    If this is a known problem, perhaps we should be told how to avoid it happening to us.

    It can be avoided by archiving the most important recordings to a USB device.

    Except THAT promised feature is still missing
  • Mark MellishMark Mellish Posts: 1Member
    edited 14 December 2012, 9:21PM
    Happened to us last night, box froze when coming out of standby. Only option was to flick the power button on the back of the unit and then everything was gone.

    Have just emailed the UK Humax support team so will post anything worthwhile that I am told.

    First box we got had a completely faulty hard drive. Quickly losing faith in Youview...
  • Dawn McGintyDawn McGinty Posts: 2Member
    edited 2 January 2013, 10:42PM
    This has just happened to me. Box froze, switched off then on again, it then reset it self and deleted all recordings 60% full drive after Xmas and new year. Contacted you view and it isn't a know problem (wish I had read this first). Have been advised to contact BT and report as a faulty box and get a replacement. BT as useless as ever. I can't trust this box, so what's the point of recording anything again. Looks like sky might be getting a phone call in the morning
  • Phil RhodesPhil Rhodes Posts: 1Member
    edited 30 November 2013, 4:03PM
    Just had the same problem as you so it's clearly not fixed. It's restarted fine but lost all recordings!
Sign In or Register to comment.