What if a YouView update bricks my box after warranty?

Lbear1Lbear1 Member Posts: 741
edited 3 May 2017, 11:39PM in Archived Posts
What happens when a Youview update bricks my box after the warranty is up? Like many (well about a thousand), I got my box with a 1 year warranty from the first week in July 2012. So far the March update seems to have caused more problems in terms of sticking FF/Skip keys, the box freezing and having to be reset, failed recordings etc than I ever had before.

I am on my second box after the first was hit by both the "multiple boot" and the "reset and wipe all recordings" bugs at the same time and I suspected a faulty hard drive.

The updates have been known to mess up some boxes completely with the only response from Humax being to swap out. What happens if this happens to me or the 1000 odd with trial boxes and one year warranties after July 2013?

At the moment the Humax is "unfit for purpose" in that you cannot reliably record, cannot guarantee that you will not have to wait 20 minutes and/or reset the box when changing channels and any attempt to fast forward/skip forward or fast back/skip back can result in the function getting stuck forcing you to stop playback and resume after attempting to find your place.

So, will I actually get a fully functioning PVR by 2 July (2013 that is) or will Youview still be sending out bug fix updates that do not fix bugs, introduce more or brick boxes until Humax go bust with the cost of returns?
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Comments

  • PPP QQQPPP QQQ Member Posts: 857
    edited 6 April 2013, 8:34AM
    After the end of a manufacturer's warranty, purchases are still covered by consumer legislation. Trial boxes aren't, so if it dies it dies.
  • KeithKeith Member, Super User Posts: 2,453 ✭✭✭
    edited 4 March 2017, 9:29AM
    The boot fail invalid signature (BFIS) issue is supposed to be resolved by the 6/3/2013 update. So provided your box has received that update successfully it should not suffer that exact issue. That of course does not preclude similar problems occurring in the future that could still brick the box.

    Given that the 2000 or so trialists got their boxes for free and were then kindly given a 1 year warranty too, if the box fails after that period then given that we did not purchase it they could perfectly reasonably say that is that and no fix/replacement would be offered. If the box failure were as a result of an update they provided or a fundamental bug like the BFIS issue then one might still hope they would consider offering a replacement or some other compromise to replace the box given they are partially responsible.

    If my box did fail soon after the 1 year warranty then if it was a hardware issue I would think carefully before buying a replacement and probably not do so if the hardware was apparently identical, although I would hope if there were weaknesses in the hardware those would be addressed by then either within the same model or with a minor variant model being released and the old model being phased out from purchase.

    If my box failed soon after the 1 year warranty and the issue appeared to be more software related then I would also be considering whether I considered the platform to be well enough developed and robust at that point as well as feature rich enough to convince me it remained the best product for me available at that time at about that price.

    Although my first box suffered a hardware failure I had very few problems with it up to that point (primarily the long double boot issue that was introduced and then fixed) and have had no significant problems with the replacement since that time. I do see some issues but they do not significantly affect me, e.g. very rarely I may get a slightly clipped recording on channel 5 (from which I rarely record), I do see a black screen for a few seconds sometimes when starting to play a recording or changing a channel, and I do occasionally suffer the stuck skipping problem too.

    I very much hope though I will not experience a hardware failure with my replacement box and that the software continues to develop to become more robust and with a few more useful features such that I will be very happy continuing to use the box as my only PVR for the foreseeable future.
  • edited 26 September 2013, 7:34AM
    If you bought your box and registered it with Humax within 30 days of purchase you'll have a two year warranty.

    You automatically have a one year warranty on your New Humax product.
    To upgrade to a 2 year warranty absolutely free, please register within 30 days of purchase of your new Humax product.


    http://www.humaxdigital.com/uk/regist...

    EDIT: I started my post long before hitting 'POST' and didn't pick up that the OP's box is ex-trial.
  • PPP QQQPPP QQQ Member Posts: 857
    edited 6 April 2013, 9:26AM
    Given that the 2000 or so trialists got their boxes for free and were then kindly given a 1 year warranty too, if the box fails after that period then given that we did not purchase it they could perfectly reasonably say that is that and no fix/replacement would be offered. If the box failure were as a result of an update they provided or a fundamental bug like the BFIS issue then one might still hope they would consider offering a replacement or some other compromise to replace the box given they are partially responsible.
    Surely not, for a free box. Humax's responsibility to triallists must end somewhere, in all fairness.

    But Humax/YouView might choose to keep the triallists involved, as the combined triallist experience to date must be a very useful resource for further clearance of bugs.
  • KeithKeith Member, Super User Posts: 2,453 ✭✭✭
    edited 4 March 2017, 9:29AM
    Hi aisha - yes I agree Humax have no responsibility to trialists after the 1 year (and did not actually need to offer the 1 year warranty or even let us keep the boxes) which is what my first sentence quoted above says. Even so I could imagine a situation where they want to avoid bad publicity so if it is their software that bricks the box they might offer special terms for a replacement, e.g. a reduced price or some other offer although it would be unlikely to be zero cost. I do not really see that happening though in any significant way as I would not expect software to brick the box in the future in any significant numbers even though it has in the past.
  • PPP QQQPPP QQQ Member Posts: 857
    edited 6 April 2013, 9:52AM
    Keith1 said:

    Hi aisha - yes I agree Humax have no responsibility to trialists after the 1 year (and did not actually need to offer the 1 year warranty or even let us keep the boxes) which is what my first sentence quoted above says. Even so I could imagine a situation where they want to avoid bad publicity so if it is their software that bricks the box they might offer special terms for a replacement, e.g. a reduced price or some other offer although it would be unlikely to be zero cost. I do not really see that happening though in any significant way as I would not expect software to brick the box in the future in any significant numbers even though it has in the past.

    Keith - yes, I agree with both points.
  • darucladarucla Member Posts: 52
    edited 28 February 2017, 2:05PM
    I would disagree that my trial box was "free". I place some value on my time, and spent quite a lot of that time on testing the box in the first few months, as I suspect did most of the trial group. Probably well beyond the retail value of the box, let alone the cost to YouView. The mere fact that YouView didn't necessarily act upon my suggestions is irrelevant.
  • redchizredchiz Member, Super User Posts: 5,454 ✭✭✭
    edited 20 December 2016, 12:57PM
    darucla said:

    I would disagree that my trial box was "free". I place some value on my time, and spent quite a lot of that time on testing the box in the first few months, as I suspect did most of the trial group. Probably well beyond the retail value of the box, let alone the cost to YouView. The mere fact that YouView didn't necessarily act upon my suggestions is irrelevant.

    How bizarre. You volunteered to take part in the trial on the basis of the T&Cs. Your current interpretation is both risible and irrelevant.
  • churchwardenchurchwarden Member Posts: 795
    edited 3 May 2017, 11:39PM
    As a someone who was (and is still) pleased to get the trial box, I agree with Keith. Whilst there would be absolutely no obligation to replace the box after the one-year period, common-sense suggests that each case would best be viewed on the circumstances. The fact that the warranty expires after a year does not preclude box replacement, should YouView/Humax decide that the circumstances warrant it. As Keith says, whilst it should not be 'expected', it may be sensible and expedient for them to provide some sort of compromise solution.
  • Lbear1Lbear1 Member Posts: 741
    edited 6 April 2013, 1:03PM
    Keith1 said:

    Hi aisha - yes I agree Humax have no responsibility to trialists after the 1 year (and did not actually need to offer the 1 year warranty or even let us keep the boxes) which is what my first sentence quoted above says. Even so I could imagine a situation where they want to avoid bad publicity so if it is their software that bricks the box they might offer special terms for a replacement, e.g. a reduced price or some other offer although it would be unlikely to be zero cost. I do not really see that happening though in any significant way as I would not expect software to brick the box in the future in any significant numbers even though it has in the past.

    Kieth, yes that I expect nothing from Humax after the 1 year period ends is based entirely on my knowledge of the dreadful way they treat Foxsat HD owners whose power supply capacitors blow after 731 days, despite this being a known fault with the ones they use. (For information, when mine went and the Argos receipt was blank through fading of the thermal printing, I was quoted £90 as their standard out of guarantee fee, despite the capacitors costing about £1)

    What however I am suggesting is that because these boxes are currently not capable of performing basic PVR functions reliably (and let's face it, they are unlikely to comply with the base YouView specifications by July), there is a moral responsibility on YouView to remedy the position if a post July update bricks a Humax box or one from Huawei for that matter.

    Passing over ownership by YouView was, after all, a calculated move to get a knowledgeable group of people into advocating for it and to help person support forums (making it even more obvious by your award). I hardly think they would want a (larger?) group of dissatisfied owners of "Norwegian Blue" boxes disseminating their experiences.
  • edited 25 April 2013, 6:59PM
    Keith1 said:

    Hi aisha - yes I agree Humax have no responsibility to trialists after the 1 year (and did not actually need to offer the 1 year warranty or even let us keep the boxes) which is what my first sentence quoted above says. Even so I could imagine a situation where they want to avoid bad publicity so if it is their software that bricks the box they might offer special terms for a replacement, e.g. a reduced price or some other offer although it would be unlikely to be zero cost. I do not really see that happening though in any significant way as I would not expect software to brick the box in the future in any significant numbers even though it has in the past.

    Sounds an awful like you're threatening to go around public stamping your foot if you don't get ongoing support and replacements for a box you paid nothing for.

    The trial invitation didn't promise the ability to keep the box, the offer to keep it was made at the end, the 1 year warranty offered shortly after.

    At no stage were you obliged to apply for the trial, keep the box or use it once it was given to you. When the warranty you accepted expires you'll be in the same position as anyone else with an out of warranty product.

    Why should your participation in the trial entitle you to more? After how many years or decades do you think that entitlement ends?
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,656 ✭✭✭
    edited 6 March 2017, 9:48PM
    I've got an extended warranty on my box from Richer Sounds. I don't normally purchase these, but in this case, I expect to need it.
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • Lbear1Lbear1 Member Posts: 741
    edited 6 April 2013, 3:05PM
    Keith1 said:

    Hi aisha - yes I agree Humax have no responsibility to trialists after the 1 year (and did not actually need to offer the 1 year warranty or even let us keep the boxes) which is what my first sentence quoted above says. Even so I could imagine a situation where they want to avoid bad publicity so if it is their software that bricks the box they might offer special terms for a replacement, e.g. a reduced price or some other offer although it would be unlikely to be zero cost. I do not really see that happening though in any significant way as I would not expect software to brick the box in the future in any significant numbers even though it has in the past.

    It's not the participation in the trial that is my concern, it is whether YouView who issue the updates produce one that manages to brick boxes in future. I can assure you that if that does happen I will be doing rather more than stamping my foot.

    Like several others I have learned not to rely on the T1000 to record or retain for viewing an important programme and I have no hesitation in not recommending people buy one until the boxes function as could reasonably be expected. Certainly I will not be buying another Humax until a lot of faults and bugs are fixed. I personally consider the T1000 another (along with the Foxsat HD) to be one of Humax's comparatively rare "lemons" and that the problems are mostly down to having to work within the restrictions placed by YouView in refusing to allow machine-specific features as allowed for in the base specs (yes I have read the document several times in detail!).

    The T1000 was not and in my view is not ready for market and neither should carry the "YouView" logo as they do not meet the basic spec yet. Very little account was taken of machine problems and functionality suggestions during the trial which mostly concerned how the box was to be marketed. Lord Candyman wanted to drag Project Canvas to market ASAP and then bailed.

    It is also notable that apart from Huawei, none of the original "device partners" have marketed a box. Pace, Technicolor and Cisco have all pulled out (maybe Pace learned the lesson of having other people involved in their boxes' firmware with their ill fated Phillips FVHD boxes). Manhattan and Vestel have gone VERY quiet about when or if they will attempt to market a YouView box.
  • Lbear1Lbear1 Member Posts: 741
    edited 6 April 2013, 3:08PM
    Roy1 said:

    I've got an extended warranty on my box from Richer Sounds. I don't normally purchase these, but in this case, I expect to need it.

    After my experiences with the Foxsat HD and the T1000, I always recommend that route if people want to purchase any Humax product. That is unfortunate given Humax's previous reputation for reliable and well built boxes.
  • Lbear1Lbear1 Member Posts: 741
    edited 6 April 2013, 3:19PM
    Keith1 said:

    The boot fail invalid signature (BFIS) issue is supposed to be resolved by the 6/3/2013 update. So provided your box has received that update successfully it should not suffer that exact issue. That of course does not preclude similar problems occurring in the future that could still brick the box.

    Given that the 2000 or so trialists got their boxes for free and were then kindly given a 1 year warranty too, if the box fails after that period then given that we did not purchase it they could perfectly reasonably say that is that and no fix/replacement would be offered. If the box failure were as a result of an update they provided or a fundamental bug like the BFIS issue then one might still hope they would consider offering a replacement or some other compromise to replace the box given they are partially responsible.

    If my box did fail soon after the 1 year warranty then if it was a hardware issue I would think carefully before buying a replacement and probably not do so if the hardware was apparently identical, although I would hope if there were weaknesses in the hardware those would be addressed by then either within the same model or with a minor variant model being released and the old model being phased out from purchase.

    If my box failed soon after the 1 year warranty and the issue appeared to be more software related then I would also be considering whether I considered the platform to be well enough developed and robust at that point as well as feature rich enough to convince me it remained the best product for me available at that time at about that price.

    Although my first box suffered a hardware failure I had very few problems with it up to that point (primarily the long double boot issue that was introduced and then fixed) and have had no significant problems with the replacement since that time. I do see some issues but they do not significantly affect me, e.g. very rarely I may get a slightly clipped recording on channel 5 (from which I rarely record), I do see a black screen for a few seconds sometimes when starting to play a recording or changing a channel, and I do occasionally suffer the stuck skipping problem too.

    I very much hope though I will not experience a hardware failure with my replacement box and that the software continues to develop to become more robust and with a few more useful features such that I will be very happy continuing to use the box as my only PVR for the foreseeable future.

    I agree with most of your points however what I have noticed is that the March update appears to exacerbate many of the problems with the DTR T1000. Before that I did not experience "pink screen" or such frequent failed recordings and complete lack of handshaking on startup.

    A weekly careful cold reset cleared up most of the delays and freezing. Now the thing is taking 20 minutes to change channels at times and fast/skip forward is freezing so often that it is easier and quicker to sit through adverts or watch catchup rather than recordings. I think I am an average three warm resets a day at the moment.

    I am actually starting to wonder whether the YV interface has become "bloatware" and the memory available as per base spec is inadequate for it.
  • edited 25 April 2013, 6:59PM
    Keith1 said:

    Hi aisha - yes I agree Humax have no responsibility to trialists after the 1 year (and did not actually need to offer the 1 year warranty or even let us keep the boxes) which is what my first sentence quoted above says. Even so I could imagine a situation where they want to avoid bad publicity so if it is their software that bricks the box they might offer special terms for a replacement, e.g. a reduced price or some other offer although it would be unlikely to be zero cost. I do not really see that happening though in any significant way as I would not expect software to brick the box in the future in any significant numbers even though it has in the past.

    >> I can assure you that if that does happen I will be doing rather more than stamping my foot.

    Why? You'll have lost nothing. You didn't pay for the box, you just said that you don't rely on it for important programmes and you actively seek to dissuade people from buying one.

    So what loss would you actually suffer if the box stopped working?

    Why are you persisting with a box you have so low an opinion of? Is it really just so you can have a tantrum if an update bricks it in a couple of months?

    It was a trial you signed up to, not conscription. If you don't like the box, stop using it and move on with a box you do like.
  • edited 25 April 2013, 6:59PM
    Roy1 said:

    I've got an extended warranty on my box from Richer Sounds. I don't normally purchase these, but in this case, I expect to need it.

    HI Roy

    Just FYI, any Humax product gets a free 2 year warranty if you register it with them within 30 days of purchase.

    Might save you a few £ on an extended warranty in future.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,656 ✭✭✭
    edited 7 December 2016, 7:38AM
    Roy1 said:

    I've got an extended warranty on my box from Richer Sounds. I don't normally purchase these, but in this case, I expect to need it.

    Yes, thanks, I saw that. But the Richer warranty lasts a bit longer than 2 years, and I hope this box isn't going to be superannuated that quickly :-)
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • PPP QQQPPP QQQ Member Posts: 857
    edited 6 April 2013, 6:26PM
    It's not the participation in the trial that is my concern, it is whether YouView who issue the updates produce one that manages to brick boxes in future.
    You do have a choice. You can avoid updates by disconnecting the ethernet lead overnight when an update is out.

    That way, you avoid the possible damage you're worrying about. But you also miss out on possible improvements, and your box could still fail at some point.
  • darucladarucla Member Posts: 52
    edited 6 April 2013, 6:08PM
    darucla said:

    I would disagree that my trial box was "free". I place some value on my time, and spent quite a lot of that time on testing the box in the first few months, as I suspect did most of the trial group. Probably well beyond the retail value of the box, let alone the cost to YouView. The mere fact that YouView didn't necessarily act upon my suggestions is irrelevant.

    Thank you for your considered and polite reply. But perhaps I should have used smileys as this forum seems to be so blind to any kind of implied humour.

    And seriously, does anyone think that YouView gave away 2,000+ boxes out of the goodness of their hearts? I was told by them that I would receive the box as long as I finished the complete run of surveys. That sounds like a contract to me.

    Nevertheless, I really don't expect YouView to release auto-downloaded firmware which will brick the box in future. That would be crazy.
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭
    edited 26 February 2017, 1:39PM
    redchiz less than a minute ago
    How bizarre. You volunteered to take part in the trial on the basis of the T&Cs. Your current interpretation is both risible and irrelevant.
    Agree.

    So.... for getting a free Freeview HD IPTV box, the OP's time has been taken up. Oh dear.

    And yet if the above did happen (bricked), there would be no monetary loss to the OP. Only the time spent on the trial. Which resulted in the OP getting a free HD box that may or may not give up the ghost in the future.

    I actually laughed when I read this thread. The term cake and eat comes to mind.

    And sorry if thats harsh. But its true.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • gomezgomez Member Posts: 2,073 ✭✭
    edited 6 April 2013, 6:11PM
    PPP QQQ said:

    It's not the participation in the trial that is my concern, it is whether YouView who issue the updates produce one that manages to brick boxes in future.
    You do have a choice. You can avoid updates by disconnecting the ethernet lead overnight when an update is out.

    That way, you avoid the possible damage you're worrying about. But you also miss out on possible improvements, and your box could still fail at some point.That would mean leaving the box permanently disconnected. It is not like OTA updates, they are *always* "out".
  • edited 6 April 2013, 6:13PM
    Visionman said:

    redchiz less than a minute ago
    How bizarre. You volunteered to take part in the trial on the basis of the T&Cs. Your current interpretation is both risible and irrelevant.
    Agree.

    So.... for getting a free Freeview HD IPTV box, the OP's time has been taken up. Oh dear.

    And yet if the above did happen (bricked), there would be no monetary loss to the OP. Only the time spent on the trial. Which resulted in the OP getting a free HD box that may or may not give up the ghost in the future.

    I actually laughed when I read this thread. The term cake and eat comes to mind.

    And sorry if thats harsh. But its true.Quite.
  • PPP QQQPPP QQQ Member Posts: 857
    edited 6 April 2013, 6:26PM
    PPP QQQ said:

    It's not the participation in the trial that is my concern, it is whether YouView who issue the updates produce one that manages to brick boxes in future.
    You do have a choice. You can avoid updates by disconnecting the ethernet lead overnight when an update is out.

    That way, you avoid the possible damage you're worrying about. But you also miss out on possible improvements, and your box could still fail at some point.Would it? I thought it would only be "pushed" to the box overnight. Guess I was mistaken.

    Although it still seems to me that by continuing to use the connected box, knowing that updates may be received, the OP is consenting to accept the update.
  • PPP QQQPPP QQQ Member Posts: 857
    edited 6 April 2013, 6:33PM
    Keith1 said:

    The boot fail invalid signature (BFIS) issue is supposed to be resolved by the 6/3/2013 update. So provided your box has received that update successfully it should not suffer that exact issue. That of course does not preclude similar problems occurring in the future that could still brick the box.

    Given that the 2000 or so trialists got their boxes for free and were then kindly given a 1 year warranty too, if the box fails after that period then given that we did not purchase it they could perfectly reasonably say that is that and no fix/replacement would be offered. If the box failure were as a result of an update they provided or a fundamental bug like the BFIS issue then one might still hope they would consider offering a replacement or some other compromise to replace the box given they are partially responsible.

    If my box did fail soon after the 1 year warranty then if it was a hardware issue I would think carefully before buying a replacement and probably not do so if the hardware was apparently identical, although I would hope if there were weaknesses in the hardware those would be addressed by then either within the same model or with a minor variant model being released and the old model being phased out from purchase.

    If my box failed soon after the 1 year warranty and the issue appeared to be more software related then I would also be considering whether I considered the platform to be well enough developed and robust at that point as well as feature rich enough to convince me it remained the best product for me available at that time at about that price.

    Although my first box suffered a hardware failure I had very few problems with it up to that point (primarily the long double boot issue that was introduced and then fixed) and have had no significant problems with the replacement since that time. I do see some issues but they do not significantly affect me, e.g. very rarely I may get a slightly clipped recording on channel 5 (from which I rarely record), I do see a black screen for a few seconds sometimes when starting to play a recording or changing a channel, and I do occasionally suffer the stuck skipping problem too.

    I very much hope though I will not experience a hardware failure with my replacement box and that the software continues to develop to become more robust and with a few more useful features such that I will be very happy continuing to use the box as my only PVR for the foreseeable future.

    Sounds like you need another replacement. I don't get any of these issues except occasionally the runaway skip.
  • Lbear1Lbear1 Member Posts: 741
    edited 6 April 2013, 6:45PM
    Keith1 said:

    The boot fail invalid signature (BFIS) issue is supposed to be resolved by the 6/3/2013 update. So provided your box has received that update successfully it should not suffer that exact issue. That of course does not preclude similar problems occurring in the future that could still brick the box.

    Given that the 2000 or so trialists got their boxes for free and were then kindly given a 1 year warranty too, if the box fails after that period then given that we did not purchase it they could perfectly reasonably say that is that and no fix/replacement would be offered. If the box failure were as a result of an update they provided or a fundamental bug like the BFIS issue then one might still hope they would consider offering a replacement or some other compromise to replace the box given they are partially responsible.

    If my box did fail soon after the 1 year warranty then if it was a hardware issue I would think carefully before buying a replacement and probably not do so if the hardware was apparently identical, although I would hope if there were weaknesses in the hardware those would be addressed by then either within the same model or with a minor variant model being released and the old model being phased out from purchase.

    If my box failed soon after the 1 year warranty and the issue appeared to be more software related then I would also be considering whether I considered the platform to be well enough developed and robust at that point as well as feature rich enough to convince me it remained the best product for me available at that time at about that price.

    Although my first box suffered a hardware failure I had very few problems with it up to that point (primarily the long double boot issue that was introduced and then fixed) and have had no significant problems with the replacement since that time. I do see some issues but they do not significantly affect me, e.g. very rarely I may get a slightly clipped recording on channel 5 (from which I rarely record), I do see a black screen for a few seconds sometimes when starting to play a recording or changing a channel, and I do occasionally suffer the stuck skipping problem too.

    I very much hope though I will not experience a hardware failure with my replacement box and that the software continues to develop to become more robust and with a few more useful features such that I will be very happy continuing to use the box as my only PVR for the foreseeable future.

    Which would make the average life of my Humax DRT T1000s approximately 4 months! I am ever hopeful that YouView will fix these bugs, some of which have been known for over 5 months however if it gets to the end of May and they still persist, there'll be another email to Humax's Marketing Department who are rather better at getting action out of since you bypass their Customer helpless mail team (they are the ones who sent me a 16 word response to a query which contained three factual errors about the T1000)
  • PPP QQQPPP QQQ Member Posts: 857
    edited 6 April 2013, 7:06PM
    Keith1 said:

    The boot fail invalid signature (BFIS) issue is supposed to be resolved by the 6/3/2013 update. So provided your box has received that update successfully it should not suffer that exact issue. That of course does not preclude similar problems occurring in the future that could still brick the box.

    Given that the 2000 or so trialists got their boxes for free and were then kindly given a 1 year warranty too, if the box fails after that period then given that we did not purchase it they could perfectly reasonably say that is that and no fix/replacement would be offered. If the box failure were as a result of an update they provided or a fundamental bug like the BFIS issue then one might still hope they would consider offering a replacement or some other compromise to replace the box given they are partially responsible.

    If my box did fail soon after the 1 year warranty then if it was a hardware issue I would think carefully before buying a replacement and probably not do so if the hardware was apparently identical, although I would hope if there were weaknesses in the hardware those would be addressed by then either within the same model or with a minor variant model being released and the old model being phased out from purchase.

    If my box failed soon after the 1 year warranty and the issue appeared to be more software related then I would also be considering whether I considered the platform to be well enough developed and robust at that point as well as feature rich enough to convince me it remained the best product for me available at that time at about that price.

    Although my first box suffered a hardware failure I had very few problems with it up to that point (primarily the long double boot issue that was introduced and then fixed) and have had no significant problems with the replacement since that time. I do see some issues but they do not significantly affect me, e.g. very rarely I may get a slightly clipped recording on channel 5 (from which I rarely record), I do see a black screen for a few seconds sometimes when starting to play a recording or changing a channel, and I do occasionally suffer the stuck skipping problem too.

    I very much hope though I will not experience a hardware failure with my replacement box and that the software continues to develop to become more robust and with a few more useful features such that I will be very happy continuing to use the box as my only PVR for the foreseeable future.

    Your attitude does seem to me very odd, considering you got the box for free. If I were you, instead of using such childish insults about Humax, I'd ring them up, explain the problems, and ask nicely for a replacement.
  • edited 25 April 2013, 6:58PM
    Keith1 said:

    The boot fail invalid signature (BFIS) issue is supposed to be resolved by the 6/3/2013 update. So provided your box has received that update successfully it should not suffer that exact issue. That of course does not preclude similar problems occurring in the future that could still brick the box.

    Given that the 2000 or so trialists got their boxes for free and were then kindly given a 1 year warranty too, if the box fails after that period then given that we did not purchase it they could perfectly reasonably say that is that and no fix/replacement would be offered. If the box failure were as a result of an update they provided or a fundamental bug like the BFIS issue then one might still hope they would consider offering a replacement or some other compromise to replace the box given they are partially responsible.

    If my box did fail soon after the 1 year warranty then if it was a hardware issue I would think carefully before buying a replacement and probably not do so if the hardware was apparently identical, although I would hope if there were weaknesses in the hardware those would be addressed by then either within the same model or with a minor variant model being released and the old model being phased out from purchase.

    If my box failed soon after the 1 year warranty and the issue appeared to be more software related then I would also be considering whether I considered the platform to be well enough developed and robust at that point as well as feature rich enough to convince me it remained the best product for me available at that time at about that price.

    Although my first box suffered a hardware failure I had very few problems with it up to that point (primarily the long double boot issue that was introduced and then fixed) and have had no significant problems with the replacement since that time. I do see some issues but they do not significantly affect me, e.g. very rarely I may get a slightly clipped recording on channel 5 (from which I rarely record), I do see a black screen for a few seconds sometimes when starting to play a recording or changing a channel, and I do occasionally suffer the stuck skipping problem too.

    I very much hope though I will not experience a hardware failure with my replacement box and that the software continues to develop to become more robust and with a few more useful features such that I will be very happy continuing to use the box as my only PVR for the foreseeable future.

    It's the sense of entitlement that sits so oddly.

    Man doesn't pay for box, man doesn't like box, man persists in using box, man wants lifetime guarantee for box or implies highly critical public campaign.

    Just stop using the box and find another you do like.
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭
    edited 26 February 2017, 1:39PM
    Peter Wells less than a minute ago
    Which would make the average life of my Humax DRT T1000s approximately 4 months! I am ever hopeful that YouView will fix these bugs, some of which have been known for over 5 months however if it gets to the end of May and they still persist, there'll be another email to Humax's Marketing Department who are rather better at getting action out of since you bypass their Customer helpless mail team (they are the ones who sent me a 16 word response to a query which contained three factual errors about the T1000).
    You are pedantry, to say the least.

    If your free box is no longer fit for purpose then simply stop using it. You haven't lost anything by doing so.

    And if you don't actually like the box, doubly so.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • Lbear1Lbear1 Member Posts: 741
    edited 6 April 2013, 7:35PM
    Keith1 said:

    The boot fail invalid signature (BFIS) issue is supposed to be resolved by the 6/3/2013 update. So provided your box has received that update successfully it should not suffer that exact issue. That of course does not preclude similar problems occurring in the future that could still brick the box.

    Given that the 2000 or so trialists got their boxes for free and were then kindly given a 1 year warranty too, if the box fails after that period then given that we did not purchase it they could perfectly reasonably say that is that and no fix/replacement would be offered. If the box failure were as a result of an update they provided or a fundamental bug like the BFIS issue then one might still hope they would consider offering a replacement or some other compromise to replace the box given they are partially responsible.

    If my box did fail soon after the 1 year warranty then if it was a hardware issue I would think carefully before buying a replacement and probably not do so if the hardware was apparently identical, although I would hope if there were weaknesses in the hardware those would be addressed by then either within the same model or with a minor variant model being released and the old model being phased out from purchase.

    If my box failed soon after the 1 year warranty and the issue appeared to be more software related then I would also be considering whether I considered the platform to be well enough developed and robust at that point as well as feature rich enough to convince me it remained the best product for me available at that time at about that price.

    Although my first box suffered a hardware failure I had very few problems with it up to that point (primarily the long double boot issue that was introduced and then fixed) and have had no significant problems with the replacement since that time. I do see some issues but they do not significantly affect me, e.g. very rarely I may get a slightly clipped recording on channel 5 (from which I rarely record), I do see a black screen for a few seconds sometimes when starting to play a recording or changing a channel, and I do occasionally suffer the stuck skipping problem too.

    I very much hope though I will not experience a hardware failure with my replacement box and that the software continues to develop to become more robust and with a few more useful features such that I will be very happy continuing to use the box as my only PVR for the foreseeable future.

    Actually man is given box in payment for time responding to surveys and for participating in the triallists' forum during which various points and suggestions for improvements were made - many of which are still outstanding. Such exchanges are common in market research

    I actually really liked the box and was enthusiastically promoting it to others - until the first one wiped some particularly important recordings I had been saving for reference in writing an article.

    I have also tolerated the idiosyncrasies of the box since the New Year when I got the replacement as these were not too significant - until the last firmware update, which is what prompted my question.

    Come back to me when after your box has bricked or wiped your recordings. Hope you have taken two copies, one physical the other electronic, of your receipt or, if you are a triallist, the email from the delivery company notifying you of the delivery date.
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