[Discussion] Humax software update 27.46.0

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Comments

  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,658 ✭✭✭
    edited 22 March 2017, 4:01PM
    NickH said:

    I thought I'd try and explain why the use of thumbnail images in the new UI is wrong. Here goes...

    The use of thumbnails has it roots in cover art. Despite being told not to, people do judge books by their cover. In the pre-digital age music albums were recognised by the cover/box of the vinyl/CD. Cinematic films are advertised on billboards by an image that attempts to convey the themes of the film. Cover art is a highly evolved medium and very much a part of life.

    When Apple introduced album cover art to iTunes and the iPod it was pretty cool. Being able to flick through a carousel of images was a neat way to quickly find the album you are looking for. However, there is an underlying assumption that the user will be able to effortlessly recognise the album they're seeking simply from a brief glimpse of an image. Certainly during the period when people were transitioning from owning music on a physical media to digital, people did recognise their favourite albums based purely on the image that was on the front of the CD case.

    The cool cover art approach to browsing your music collection was undoubtedly a great addition, but Apple always retained the option to browse the collection via sorted lists - which could be sorted by many different metadata fields. The aim was to provide the quickest and easiest way to access the collection.

    A critical factor in the success of Apple's album art implementation was responsiveness. The concept worked well because the speed with which the carousel turned was variable. The user could choose to flick through slowly, or they could rapidly move to a much later point. Without the responsiveness the attraction of using the interface is greatly diminished, and would easily become frustrating.

    Browsing a collection by thumbnail images can be extended from music albums to films because the film's title and its artwork are designed to work together. People associate their favourite films with the images that are used to promote them. In addition, people can easily judge the type of film based purely on the image. If they're looking for an action film they know to skip past the one with the image of a cute kitten, or if they don't like horror then the image filled with bloody gore probably isn't for them.

    The use of thumbnails has been extended to previewing written documents, but in this case the usage is very much for preview and navigation within the document. Only in the case when the first page of the document contains the title in large text can a thumbnail be used to represent it – and in that case the thumbnail is simply a pictorial rendering of the text.

    So, in a world when thumbnails are cool and trendy, YouView thought it wise to revamp the MyView Recordings and Schedule screen. Unfortunately they failed to appreciate a fundamental point. The thumbnails are only beneficial if the user, upon first seeing a thumbnail, can effortlessly determine exactly which TV programme it represents. This is not the case. When I record a programme I do not know what thumbnail will be associated with it, therefore when I view the recordings screen the presence of a thumbnail does not allow me to quickly find the programme. I know the title of the programme, and I might know when it was recorded; both pieces of information are much easier to find when presented in a sorted list.

    Proof that the use of thumbnails has been applied without sufficient thought is the fact that the first thumbnail on each page is 4 times the size of the others. Why make the first one larger? It does not have any special status, it is only larger because due to the number of recordings (or scheduled items) it happens to be the first one on a given page. No doubt the layout looked great as a screenshot in a Powerpoint presentation, but in terms of enhancing the usability it is utterly worthless.

    We are not being Luddites by disliking the new Recordings and Schedule screens. We are arguing that in this context the thumbnails are not beneficial, and actually make navigating the screens more difficult than they previously were. YouView absolutely need to add an option to show the recordings and schedule as a list. From an engineering perspective, I'd be very surprised if presenting the data as list is not easier than presenting it as thumbnails. We are not asking for something that is difficult. YouView need to acknowledge that they've made a fundamental mistake, and rectify it as soon as possible.

    It's there, but below the 1 2 3......
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • Steve29Steve29 Member Posts: 13
    edited 23 March 2017, 12:23AM
    Visionman said:

    https://community.youview.com/youview/topics/-discussion-humax-software-update-27-46-0?topic-reply-l...

    An impressive post, NickH, in which you appear to have either an academic or professional background. Most impressive indeed.
    However, I feel the need to point out the tiles are staying, and the more graphically rich presentation prevalent on NextGen is the way YouView have decided to go, and they are not going back.
    The tiles aren't my issue though, its the series folder access that is NextGens most major concern and needs to be addressed as a matter of urgency.
    Unfortunately that won't be until the rollout has been completed, which should be sometime around the end of June, with BT and Plusnet being the tail enders.

    At Least with Humax foxsat boxes you can user control and chose updates
  • Steve29Steve29 Member Posts: 13
    edited 23 March 2017, 12:39AM

    I'm very unhappy about this software update. I purchased my DTRT1000 after extensive research because I liked the way the system worked and the easy to use interface. In particular I liked the list view when looking at my recorded and scheduled programmes plus the way my family could continue watching TV in a small screen whilst I looked at the program guide or recordings list. It was also easy for my elderly mother to operate. All of these features have been removed in this software update. If the DTRT1000 had behaved as it does now when I did my research, I would not have purchased it. Does anyone know my legal position now? The unit is no longer fit for my purpose because of this update which I did not request and was not given the option to refuse. I would like the software to be returned to the version it was supplied with or I would like a refund of the full purchase price so I can start my research again and buy an alternative product. Please can someone advise me of my rights. Thank you.

    Agreed, if my Humax DTR T1000 YouView behaved as it does after 27.46,  i would have gone for the Humax Foxsat version
  • Steve29Steve29 Member Posts: 13
    edited 23 March 2017, 12:47AM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    "As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:"

    Interpretation:
    The incorporating of new extensive compulsive data collection to "the Cloud" is the only
    part of 27.46 that matters to YouView, all else is of no importance.

       
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 10:01AM
    Visionman said:

    https://community.youview.com/youview/topics/-discussion-humax-software-update-27-46-0?topic-reply-l...

    An impressive post, NickH, in which you appear to have either an academic or professional background. Most impressive indeed.
    However, I feel the need to point out the tiles are staying, and the more graphically rich presentation prevalent on NextGen is the way YouView have decided to go, and they are not going back.
    The tiles aren't my issue though, its the series folder access that is NextGens most major concern and needs to be addressed as a matter of urgency.
    Unfortunately that won't be until the rollout has been completed, which should be sometime around the end of June, with BT and Plusnet being the tail enders.

    Would that be the HDR 2009 or 10 year models?
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • Torqueback2Torqueback2 Member Posts: 5
    edited 23 March 2017, 10:02AM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    "Boxes all across the country might work faster and more efficiently and with less (sic - "fewer") problems"... but as they're not as intuitive, the people who own and operate them won't. "Interpretation"?
  • johnnoprobjohnnoprob Member Posts: 5
    edited 1 May 2017, 8:33AM
    FWIW Humax are offering the FreeView Play and Freeview+ boxes at a price which makes me ready to bin the Youview box. It is clear that Youview are burying their head in the sand.
    There are three clear problems
    1. The ICON view of recorded programs and schedules is harder to read and select.
    2. After watching a program, it is too hard to delete the episode you have watched and too easy to delete the whole series.
    3. The guide has the useless option of a ghost picture which is virtually invisible but can be turned off. It's a TV - why would you NOT want to see the picture whilst viewing a full guide.
    There are other issues including the apparent dependence on a 'cloud' infrastructure. This is a buzzword for ' we are spying on you -and we can use this to make money. Also, the box is no longer the unit I bought, and the apparent inability to revert ( I am asking Humax about that) is unforgivable.
  • David ManfordDavid Manford Member Posts: 6
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:05PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    My box(es) are neither faster or more efficient - rather the reverse! 
    Also a point which is not getting much coverage is the problem of boxes which are not permanently connected to the internet, one of mine spends half of its life in our static caravan where I am certainly not prepared to pay per byte for un-needed data. The result is that every time I turn the box on it tells me that there is no internet connection BUT  this message cannot simply be cleared, it takes several button presses and slow loading pages to simply get to watch a programme. 
  • redchizredchiz Member, Super User Posts: 5,454 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:08PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    David, any performance issues you may have with a box which you knowingly have not connected to the internet can hardly be blamed on this software update.
  • ben2ben2 Member Posts: 16
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:18PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    I am with you david, my box is connected but my internet is incredibly slow here.  My box is now sluggish as hell. Press a button and give it a while is incredibly annoying. This update seems to have changed the "minimum requirements" to be that of a faster internet connection than I have. You cant change the requirements a year after I bought the box YouView !!
  • NickHNickH Member Posts: 8
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:20PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    Prior to the software update the performance of the box was not affected by a lack of internet connection. So the software update is entirely to blame for the degraded performance that David is now experiencing.
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:21PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    Davids 'problem' is different to yours Ben. Whats your internet speed?
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:24PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    @David Manford - Please start your own thread on the issues your having. You'll get more help that way. 
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • redchizredchiz Member, Super User Posts: 5,454 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:26PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    NickH, we may be at cross purposes, the issue of clearing a message referring to an internet connection can only be related to a lack of internet connection, surely?
  • ben2ben2 Member Posts: 16
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:26PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    Available to the box often well under under 1mbps download visionman. This has never caused a problem in menus before. Obviously on demand takes a bit of fettling but I accepted that when I bought the box. Given nobody else is complaining about the box being sluggish I have assumed it is now slower because of more data coming over this connection, or the use of the cloud slowing things down for me. The thumbnails are downloaded right ? Those pointless annoying thumbnails.
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:29PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    Sorry to tell you this but the recommended speed for using a YouView is 2.5Mbps, on either version.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • ben2ben2 Member Posts: 16
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:36PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    @visionman I am just annoyed that it seems fine to bloat it for no good reason. On low speeds this update is much more sluggish to use. You must be able to understand the frustration. Anyway, I guess a change of plan is required for me. They wont think twice about drastic changes in the future I have no intention of risking this type of thing every time I turn my box on... MY box. I look at my humax box differently to how they do, so I guess I made a mistake and should just accept that.
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:44PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    Sorry you live in an area with such poor speeds, Ben. To be honest I'm amazed you can use on demand at all. Point of note - both this forum and the changes that are happening are nothing to do with Humax and instead YouView.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • ben2ben2 Member Posts: 16
    edited 23 March 2017, 3:50PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    Sorry, yes by 'they' I mean youview. YouView see my box differently to how I do.  I can use on demand fine when I am at about 2mbps, although because ads are higher resolution it buffers lots during those. SD programs are ok. But I have never seen the menus and epg effected significantly before. 
  • NickHNickH Member Posts: 8
    edited 23 March 2017, 4:17PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    redchiz, I think David Manford was referring to the fact that the new software is much less tolerant of being without an internet connection. I rely on mobile broadband so pay a hefty amount for a fairly limited amount of data per month. Because of this I only connected my box to the internet when I wanted to access on-demand. The box didn't complain much about the lack of internet connection, and if it did it was only a pop-up that disappeared after a few seconds. With the new software the box makes much more fuss if there's no internet connection. YouView are definitely pushing to ensure that the boxes have constant internet access. This might be understandable if they owned my box, but as far as I'm concerned I paid £200 for it and it's mine. I guess I should have read the terms and conditions more closely.
  • redchizredchiz Member, Super User Posts: 5,454 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 4:20PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    Fair enough, but a box which is designed to be connected to the internet for full functionality is and always was bound to be somewhat impaired if it isn't.
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,300 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 4:46PM

    I emailed YV viewer support & this is their response as written.

    I’m sorry to hear that you are unhappy with new update. I can certainly understand how frustrating it is especially since you prefer what it looked like before.

    The new software was trialled on a number of YouView users including us here at the YouView technical support team, before it was released. The trialists not only helped weed out any problems with the update but delivered feedback for improvements they deemed necessary.

    We have had a lot of feedback, most of which is positive, some of which is negative. However we do value your feedback and I’ll be happy to pass it on tot he relative team for you.

    As this update is not just physically or visually different, and it is actually a lot more to do with how YouView works on a whole, there is no way to permanently undo it. YouView as a service is changing, meaning that boxes all across the country will work faster and more efficiently and with less problems including:

    The new UI (User Interface) is more intuitive and easy to use

    The UI allows the user to see content before selecting the show or series

    Less clicking and more watching

    Great content discovery with a visual, simple, seamless and non-intrusive user experience across the system

    A faster playback experience on Live, IP channels and On Demand

    Less clicking and more watching with a new visual Main Menu from which viewers can launch all of our services

    Quicker access to viewers favourite Players and Apps with more now visible on the UI

    A full screen, faster Guide allowing viewers to watch, record or catch up on the content they love

    A new visual Mini-Guide, accessible from the playback bar, allowing viewers to catch up with what was on and see what’s on now, on next and in the future

    A personal TV library of recordings with the new MyTV, formally MyView, where viewers can see more recordings This is all in addition to the great features YouView already has including trick play functionality, 7 day scroll back, Record and Reminders, Search and Accessibility Features.

    I understand that it does look different, and that all changes require a little bit of getting used to, but hopefully you will get the hang of it and the visuals are not not too hard to look past. I hope that this is not too upsetting for you.

    I hope this information has helped you today. However if you do have any more queries you can either reply to this email or please don't hesitate to give me a call on 0333 313 2278. Lines are open Monday – Saturday, 10am - 8pm, and Sundays 10am - 5pm. If you ask for me personally I will be more than happy to help.

    Kind Regards,
    Kieran
    The YouView Support Team.

    NickH>
    "YouView are definitely pushing to ensure that the boxes have constant internet access." 
    Yes, of course they are, Nick. It is its design and is the reason why its called a hybrid box.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • CegCeg Member Posts: 184
    edited 23 March 2017, 5:33PM

    FWIW Humax are offering the FreeView Play and Freeview+ boxes at a price which makes me ready to bin the Youview box. It is clear that Youview are burying their head in the sand.
    There are three clear problems
    1. The ICON view of recorded programs and schedules is harder to read and select.
    2. After watching a program, it is too hard to delete the episode you have watched and too easy to delete the whole series.
    3. The guide has the useless option of a ghost picture which is virtually invisible but can be turned off. It's a TV - why would you NOT want to see the picture whilst viewing a full guide.
    There are other issues including the apparent dependence on a 'cloud' infrastructure. This is a buzzword for ' we are spying on you -and we can use this to make money. Also, the box is no longer the unit I bought, and the apparent inability to revert ( I am asking Humax about that) is unforgivable.

    I might have a play with an old raspberry pi and see how it is with a DVB-T tuner, if it works reasonably well I may take the plunge and get a rpi 3 and a dual USB DVB-T2 tuner, combined with a spare 1TB hard drive it may be a decent replacement for around £100.
  • redchizredchiz Member, Super User Posts: 5,454 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 5:34PM

    FWIW Humax are offering the FreeView Play and Freeview+ boxes at a price which makes me ready to bin the Youview box. It is clear that Youview are burying their head in the sand.
    There are three clear problems
    1. The ICON view of recorded programs and schedules is harder to read and select.
    2. After watching a program, it is too hard to delete the episode you have watched and too easy to delete the whole series.
    3. The guide has the useless option of a ghost picture which is virtually invisible but can be turned off. It's a TV - why would you NOT want to see the picture whilst viewing a full guide.
    There are other issues including the apparent dependence on a 'cloud' infrastructure. This is a buzzword for ' we are spying on you -and we can use this to make money. Also, the box is no longer the unit I bought, and the apparent inability to revert ( I am asking Humax about that) is unforgivable.

    Not sure what that has to do with the update concerned, perhaps the alternatives topic might be a better fit? I do doubt even there however that many YouView users will follow you into the world of homebrew, good luck with it though.
  • CegCeg Member Posts: 184
    edited 23 March 2017, 5:39PM

    FWIW Humax are offering the FreeView Play and Freeview+ boxes at a price which makes me ready to bin the Youview box. It is clear that Youview are burying their head in the sand.
    There are three clear problems
    1. The ICON view of recorded programs and schedules is harder to read and select.
    2. After watching a program, it is too hard to delete the episode you have watched and too easy to delete the whole series.
    3. The guide has the useless option of a ghost picture which is virtually invisible but can be turned off. It's a TV - why would you NOT want to see the picture whilst viewing a full guide.
    There are other issues including the apparent dependence on a 'cloud' infrastructure. This is a buzzword for ' we are spying on you -and we can use this to make money. Also, the box is no longer the unit I bought, and the apparent inability to revert ( I am asking Humax about that) is unforgivable.

    Was just a follow up to the previous comment about Freeview Play and Freeview+ boxes and offering another alternative. Also, I guess I wouldn't be considering alternatives were it not for the update :)
  • redchizredchiz Member, Super User Posts: 5,454 ✭✭✭
    edited 28 March 2017, 12:41PM

    FWIW Humax are offering the FreeView Play and Freeview+ boxes at a price which makes me ready to bin the Youview box. It is clear that Youview are burying their head in the sand.
    There are three clear problems
    1. The ICON view of recorded programs and schedules is harder to read and select.
    2. After watching a program, it is too hard to delete the episode you have watched and too easy to delete the whole series.
    3. The guide has the useless option of a ghost picture which is virtually invisible but can be turned off. It's a TV - why would you NOT want to see the picture whilst viewing a full guide.
    There are other issues including the apparent dependence on a 'cloud' infrastructure. This is a buzzword for ' we are spying on you -and we can use this to make money. Also, the box is no longer the unit I bought, and the apparent inability to revert ( I am asking Humax about that) is unforgivable.

    Aye, and I was just pointing out there was a more appropriate place to post it. :-)
  • JoeJoe Member, Super User Posts: 2,064 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 7:08PM
    NickH said:

    I thought I'd try and explain why the use of thumbnail images in the new UI is wrong. Here goes...

    The use of thumbnails has it roots in cover art. Despite being told not to, people do judge books by their cover. In the pre-digital age music albums were recognised by the cover/box of the vinyl/CD. Cinematic films are advertised on billboards by an image that attempts to convey the themes of the film. Cover art is a highly evolved medium and very much a part of life.

    When Apple introduced album cover art to iTunes and the iPod it was pretty cool. Being able to flick through a carousel of images was a neat way to quickly find the album you are looking for. However, there is an underlying assumption that the user will be able to effortlessly recognise the album they're seeking simply from a brief glimpse of an image. Certainly during the period when people were transitioning from owning music on a physical media to digital, people did recognise their favourite albums based purely on the image that was on the front of the CD case.

    The cool cover art approach to browsing your music collection was undoubtedly a great addition, but Apple always retained the option to browse the collection via sorted lists - which could be sorted by many different metadata fields. The aim was to provide the quickest and easiest way to access the collection.

    A critical factor in the success of Apple's album art implementation was responsiveness. The concept worked well because the speed with which the carousel turned was variable. The user could choose to flick through slowly, or they could rapidly move to a much later point. Without the responsiveness the attraction of using the interface is greatly diminished, and would easily become frustrating.

    Browsing a collection by thumbnail images can be extended from music albums to films because the film's title and its artwork are designed to work together. People associate their favourite films with the images that are used to promote them. In addition, people can easily judge the type of film based purely on the image. If they're looking for an action film they know to skip past the one with the image of a cute kitten, or if they don't like horror then the image filled with bloody gore probably isn't for them.

    The use of thumbnails has been extended to previewing written documents, but in this case the usage is very much for preview and navigation within the document. Only in the case when the first page of the document contains the title in large text can a thumbnail be used to represent it – and in that case the thumbnail is simply a pictorial rendering of the text.

    So, in a world when thumbnails are cool and trendy, YouView thought it wise to revamp the MyView Recordings and Schedule screen. Unfortunately they failed to appreciate a fundamental point. The thumbnails are only beneficial if the user, upon first seeing a thumbnail, can effortlessly determine exactly which TV programme it represents. This is not the case. When I record a programme I do not know what thumbnail will be associated with it, therefore when I view the recordings screen the presence of a thumbnail does not allow me to quickly find the programme. I know the title of the programme, and I might know when it was recorded; both pieces of information are much easier to find when presented in a sorted list.

    Proof that the use of thumbnails has been applied without sufficient thought is the fact that the first thumbnail on each page is 4 times the size of the others. Why make the first one larger? It does not have any special status, it is only larger because due to the number of recordings (or scheduled items) it happens to be the first one on a given page. No doubt the layout looked great as a screenshot in a Powerpoint presentation, but in terms of enhancing the usability it is utterly worthless.

    We are not being Luddites by disliking the new Recordings and Schedule screens. We are arguing that in this context the thumbnails are not beneficial, and actually make navigating the screens more difficult than they previously were. YouView absolutely need to add an option to show the recordings and schedule as a list. From an engineering perspective, I'd be very surprised if presenting the data as list is not easier than presenting it as thumbnails. We are not asking for something that is difficult. YouView need to acknowledge that they've made a fundamental mistake, and rectify it as soon as possible.

    Good points well made. My feeling is that there is a sensible reason to the large tile design.
    1. It enables slightly quicker navigation due to its Quadruple size which boarders on more tiles.
    2. It also serves to break up the monotony of what would be a page full of equally sized small tiles, with text and image fighting each other for dominance. Which I think is part of the design problem of the smaller tiles, and why so many people are writing to voice their opinions.
    3. It's the focal point which hints at the most recent recording on each page, this in turn helps to point the way to the chronological ordering of recordings. Left to right, top to bottom.

    From an objective point of view it's very interesting seeing how next gen is being recieved. From my experience I too had big misgiving about the change specifically to mytv. It just felt quite difficult/awkward to use at first. I've now been using next gen for a few months. My initial feelings have changed with use. I can honestly say I find it now comfortable to use and not the visual overload that I first encountered. Which may, (or may not) suggest that the change of habbits that next gen has brought about can become a lot easier for most users, and perhaps even an advantage ( as I have found) over lists. There are still things I'd like to see improved, like the abbreviated text, and series folders.

    All in all I feel happy with the direction that next gen has taken. It works for me now, but initially I was unsure like many new users here. For me at least it was just a brief period of readjusting to the new format. I still have criticisms as I have mentioned, but it feels like progress and a more engaging Youview.
  • redchizredchiz Member, Super User Posts: 5,454 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 6:08PM
    NickH said:

    I thought I'd try and explain why the use of thumbnail images in the new UI is wrong. Here goes...

    The use of thumbnails has it roots in cover art. Despite being told not to, people do judge books by their cover. In the pre-digital age music albums were recognised by the cover/box of the vinyl/CD. Cinematic films are advertised on billboards by an image that attempts to convey the themes of the film. Cover art is a highly evolved medium and very much a part of life.

    When Apple introduced album cover art to iTunes and the iPod it was pretty cool. Being able to flick through a carousel of images was a neat way to quickly find the album you are looking for. However, there is an underlying assumption that the user will be able to effortlessly recognise the album they're seeking simply from a brief glimpse of an image. Certainly during the period when people were transitioning from owning music on a physical media to digital, people did recognise their favourite albums based purely on the image that was on the front of the CD case.

    The cool cover art approach to browsing your music collection was undoubtedly a great addition, but Apple always retained the option to browse the collection via sorted lists - which could be sorted by many different metadata fields. The aim was to provide the quickest and easiest way to access the collection.

    A critical factor in the success of Apple's album art implementation was responsiveness. The concept worked well because the speed with which the carousel turned was variable. The user could choose to flick through slowly, or they could rapidly move to a much later point. Without the responsiveness the attraction of using the interface is greatly diminished, and would easily become frustrating.

    Browsing a collection by thumbnail images can be extended from music albums to films because the film's title and its artwork are designed to work together. People associate their favourite films with the images that are used to promote them. In addition, people can easily judge the type of film based purely on the image. If they're looking for an action film they know to skip past the one with the image of a cute kitten, or if they don't like horror then the image filled with bloody gore probably isn't for them.

    The use of thumbnails has been extended to previewing written documents, but in this case the usage is very much for preview and navigation within the document. Only in the case when the first page of the document contains the title in large text can a thumbnail be used to represent it – and in that case the thumbnail is simply a pictorial rendering of the text.

    So, in a world when thumbnails are cool and trendy, YouView thought it wise to revamp the MyView Recordings and Schedule screen. Unfortunately they failed to appreciate a fundamental point. The thumbnails are only beneficial if the user, upon first seeing a thumbnail, can effortlessly determine exactly which TV programme it represents. This is not the case. When I record a programme I do not know what thumbnail will be associated with it, therefore when I view the recordings screen the presence of a thumbnail does not allow me to quickly find the programme. I know the title of the programme, and I might know when it was recorded; both pieces of information are much easier to find when presented in a sorted list.

    Proof that the use of thumbnails has been applied without sufficient thought is the fact that the first thumbnail on each page is 4 times the size of the others. Why make the first one larger? It does not have any special status, it is only larger because due to the number of recordings (or scheduled items) it happens to be the first one on a given page. No doubt the layout looked great as a screenshot in a Powerpoint presentation, but in terms of enhancing the usability it is utterly worthless.

    We are not being Luddites by disliking the new Recordings and Schedule screens. We are arguing that in this context the thumbnails are not beneficial, and actually make navigating the screens more difficult than they previously were. YouView absolutely need to add an option to show the recordings and schedule as a list. From an engineering perspective, I'd be very surprised if presenting the data as list is not easier than presenting it as thumbnails. We are not asking for something that is difficult. YouView need to acknowledge that they've made a fundamental mistake, and rectify it as soon as possible.

    Well said Joe, I tend to agree. But what do you think about the series ordering and delete functionality? They are my main bugbears to be sure.
  • JoeJoe Member, Super User Posts: 2,064 ✭✭✭
    edited 24 March 2017, 11:00AM
    NickH said:

    I thought I'd try and explain why the use of thumbnail images in the new UI is wrong. Here goes...

    The use of thumbnails has it roots in cover art. Despite being told not to, people do judge books by their cover. In the pre-digital age music albums were recognised by the cover/box of the vinyl/CD. Cinematic films are advertised on billboards by an image that attempts to convey the themes of the film. Cover art is a highly evolved medium and very much a part of life.

    When Apple introduced album cover art to iTunes and the iPod it was pretty cool. Being able to flick through a carousel of images was a neat way to quickly find the album you are looking for. However, there is an underlying assumption that the user will be able to effortlessly recognise the album they're seeking simply from a brief glimpse of an image. Certainly during the period when people were transitioning from owning music on a physical media to digital, people did recognise their favourite albums based purely on the image that was on the front of the CD case.

    The cool cover art approach to browsing your music collection was undoubtedly a great addition, but Apple always retained the option to browse the collection via sorted lists - which could be sorted by many different metadata fields. The aim was to provide the quickest and easiest way to access the collection.

    A critical factor in the success of Apple's album art implementation was responsiveness. The concept worked well because the speed with which the carousel turned was variable. The user could choose to flick through slowly, or they could rapidly move to a much later point. Without the responsiveness the attraction of using the interface is greatly diminished, and would easily become frustrating.

    Browsing a collection by thumbnail images can be extended from music albums to films because the film's title and its artwork are designed to work together. People associate their favourite films with the images that are used to promote them. In addition, people can easily judge the type of film based purely on the image. If they're looking for an action film they know to skip past the one with the image of a cute kitten, or if they don't like horror then the image filled with bloody gore probably isn't for them.

    The use of thumbnails has been extended to previewing written documents, but in this case the usage is very much for preview and navigation within the document. Only in the case when the first page of the document contains the title in large text can a thumbnail be used to represent it – and in that case the thumbnail is simply a pictorial rendering of the text.

    So, in a world when thumbnails are cool and trendy, YouView thought it wise to revamp the MyView Recordings and Schedule screen. Unfortunately they failed to appreciate a fundamental point. The thumbnails are only beneficial if the user, upon first seeing a thumbnail, can effortlessly determine exactly which TV programme it represents. This is not the case. When I record a programme I do not know what thumbnail will be associated with it, therefore when I view the recordings screen the presence of a thumbnail does not allow me to quickly find the programme. I know the title of the programme, and I might know when it was recorded; both pieces of information are much easier to find when presented in a sorted list.

    Proof that the use of thumbnails has been applied without sufficient thought is the fact that the first thumbnail on each page is 4 times the size of the others. Why make the first one larger? It does not have any special status, it is only larger because due to the number of recordings (or scheduled items) it happens to be the first one on a given page. No doubt the layout looked great as a screenshot in a Powerpoint presentation, but in terms of enhancing the usability it is utterly worthless.

    We are not being Luddites by disliking the new Recordings and Schedule screens. We are arguing that in this context the thumbnails are not beneficial, and actually make navigating the screens more difficult than they previously were. YouView absolutely need to add an option to show the recordings and schedule as a list. From an engineering perspective, I'd be very surprised if presenting the data as list is not easier than presenting it as thumbnails. We are not asking for something that is difficult. YouView need to acknowledge that they've made a fundamental mistake, and rectify it as soon as possible.

    Totally. If there is a part that is actually "wrong", then that is it. The implementation of series folders feels like unfinished work.
    • The deleting problem 
    • The navigation of large series folders is a pain. They need series/ season shortcuts to break up long running recordings into more manageable navigation. ( like they already do in Youview search results)
    • Being pushed out of the folder each time you finish watching an episode is ridiculous. 
    • There should also be a "continue watching" feature, which should tie in with a system that lets you easily watch a series folder in sequential order. (much like Netflix and BBCiplayer already do)
  • scottscott Member, Super User Posts: 2,134 ✭✭✭
    edited 23 March 2017, 6:17PM
    NickH said:

    I thought I'd try and explain why the use of thumbnail images in the new UI is wrong. Here goes...

    The use of thumbnails has it roots in cover art. Despite being told not to, people do judge books by their cover. In the pre-digital age music albums were recognised by the cover/box of the vinyl/CD. Cinematic films are advertised on billboards by an image that attempts to convey the themes of the film. Cover art is a highly evolved medium and very much a part of life.

    When Apple introduced album cover art to iTunes and the iPod it was pretty cool. Being able to flick through a carousel of images was a neat way to quickly find the album you are looking for. However, there is an underlying assumption that the user will be able to effortlessly recognise the album they're seeking simply from a brief glimpse of an image. Certainly during the period when people were transitioning from owning music on a physical media to digital, people did recognise their favourite albums based purely on the image that was on the front of the CD case.

    The cool cover art approach to browsing your music collection was undoubtedly a great addition, but Apple always retained the option to browse the collection via sorted lists - which could be sorted by many different metadata fields. The aim was to provide the quickest and easiest way to access the collection.

    A critical factor in the success of Apple's album art implementation was responsiveness. The concept worked well because the speed with which the carousel turned was variable. The user could choose to flick through slowly, or they could rapidly move to a much later point. Without the responsiveness the attraction of using the interface is greatly diminished, and would easily become frustrating.

    Browsing a collection by thumbnail images can be extended from music albums to films because the film's title and its artwork are designed to work together. People associate their favourite films with the images that are used to promote them. In addition, people can easily judge the type of film based purely on the image. If they're looking for an action film they know to skip past the one with the image of a cute kitten, or if they don't like horror then the image filled with bloody gore probably isn't for them.

    The use of thumbnails has been extended to previewing written documents, but in this case the usage is very much for preview and navigation within the document. Only in the case when the first page of the document contains the title in large text can a thumbnail be used to represent it – and in that case the thumbnail is simply a pictorial rendering of the text.

    So, in a world when thumbnails are cool and trendy, YouView thought it wise to revamp the MyView Recordings and Schedule screen. Unfortunately they failed to appreciate a fundamental point. The thumbnails are only beneficial if the user, upon first seeing a thumbnail, can effortlessly determine exactly which TV programme it represents. This is not the case. When I record a programme I do not know what thumbnail will be associated with it, therefore when I view the recordings screen the presence of a thumbnail does not allow me to quickly find the programme. I know the title of the programme, and I might know when it was recorded; both pieces of information are much easier to find when presented in a sorted list.

    Proof that the use of thumbnails has been applied without sufficient thought is the fact that the first thumbnail on each page is 4 times the size of the others. Why make the first one larger? It does not have any special status, it is only larger because due to the number of recordings (or scheduled items) it happens to be the first one on a given page. No doubt the layout looked great as a screenshot in a Powerpoint presentation, but in terms of enhancing the usability it is utterly worthless.

    We are not being Luddites by disliking the new Recordings and Schedule screens. We are arguing that in this context the thumbnails are not beneficial, and actually make navigating the screens more difficult than they previously were. YouView absolutely need to add an option to show the recordings and schedule as a list. From an engineering perspective, I'd be very surprised if presenting the data as list is not easier than presenting it as thumbnails. We are not asking for something that is difficult. YouView need to acknowledge that they've made a fundamental mistake, and rectify it as soon as possible.

    did you see the 'to do' list at the YouView meeting ;-)
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