[Discussion] BT software update 31.28.0

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Comments

  • willowbank3willowbank3 Posts: 1Member

    I have the same problem as uksteves. HD channels are not available via the scart (composite) or component outputs. You can see the menus, but the screen is blank.  This also applies to playing recorded HD programmes. Other channels work fine. I have found that if you unplug the HDMI cable to the TV, it cures the problem, but this is very inconvenient.

  • ukstevesuksteves Posts: 9Member

    I have the same problem as uksteves. HD channels are not available via the scart (composite) or component outputs. You can see the menus, but the screen is blank.  This also applies to playing recorded HD programmes. Other channels work fine. I have found that if you unplug the HDMI cable to the TV, it cures the problem, but this is very inconvenient.

    Yes, I also found that unplugging the HDMI lead from the box sometimes works - but you're right, its inconvenient and really not satisfactory.  When I turn off our main TV (the one to which the HDMI cable is connected), it is switched off completely at the wall socket. You'd imagine that was as good as unplugging the HDMI cable - but it seems not.  Regardless of whether it's ever been officially supported or not, its something that had worked fine since the start of YouView... 
  • RoyRoy Posts: 14,430Member ✭✭✭
    Not quite since the start, @uksteves

    But according to this thread, what was an acknowledged bug was fixed in the February 2014 update.

    Which @Sarah might like to show to whoever in YouView misinformed her on this topic, and ask why (s)he was telling Sarah porkies....
    “Where’s ‘Jump to Time’ then? And all that other OldGen good stuff we were promised back, including the proper ‘Hide Channels’ and so on?” (Excerpt from ‘One Billboard Outside YouView Towers’, not coming soon to a box near you)
  • KevinKevin Posts: 3Member
    Sarah said:
    Hi all, 

    Please feel free to discuss the latest BT 31.28.0 software release in this discussion thread.

    This is a maintenance update containing a fix for the Failed Recordings issue.

    Thanks,
    Sarah

    Hi Sarah,

    I still cannot playback radio recordings. It seems odd that an update intended to fix the failed recording issue has not done so. Can I have an indication of when this issue will be resolved please?

  • SarahSarah Posts: 888Administrator admin
    Kevin said:
    Sarah said:
    Hi all, 

    Please feel free to discuss the latest BT 31.28.0 software release in this discussion thread.

    This is a maintenance update containing a fix for the Failed Recordings issue.

    Thanks,
    Sarah

    Hi Sarah,

    I still cannot playback radio recordings. It seems odd that an update intended to fix the failed recording issue has not done so. Can I have an indication of when this issue will be resolved please?

    Hi Kevin,

    The failed recordings and radio recordings are two separate issues, this release resolved the failed recordings issue. The radio recordings haven't failed, they're just not playing correctly. We have identified a fix for the radio recordings issue so hope to have this deployed soon once it's gone through the usual testing phase. Any radio recordings recorded before the next software release will work correctly once your box has the software update so we would not suggest deleting these unless you don't want to listen to them. 

    We have a couple of mitigations which temporarily resolve the radio recordings issue (until the next software release).

    • Remove the HDMI cable and put it back in
    • (if the above doesn’t help) Play the radio recording, then turning the box off via the remote and then back on via the remote as this seems to fix the issue at least for that particular recording. 
    Once the new software update is available, we'll post a new thread with a link to the release information, noting that it contains the fix for radio recordings. 

    Thanks,
    Sarah

  • Tim CTim C Posts: 343Member ✭✭
    I'd still love to know what was the cause of the failed recordings issue.

    What changed & where as only Youview units were affected?

    The fix in 31.28 is in truth just a work-around and was unnecessary for all the years Youview's been in existance until April this year.
    “Where’s ‘Jump to Time’ and all that other OldGen good stuff that was promised to come back, including the proper ‘Hide Channels’ etc etc.., rather than the unnecessary & unasked for that does get added and serves no useful purpose? Give me optional lists as well :) ."
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 9,002Member ✭✭✭
    "I'd still love to know what was the cause of the failed recordings issue."

    Why? Would that help you in some way?
  • RoyRoy Posts: 14,430Member ✭✭✭
    Tim C said:

    What changed & where as only Youview units were affected?
    Probably because that is all that YouView provide?
    “Where’s ‘Jump to Time’ then? And all that other OldGen good stuff we were promised back, including the proper ‘Hide Channels’ and so on?” (Excerpt from ‘One Billboard Outside YouView Towers’, not coming soon to a box near you)
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 9,002Member ✭✭✭
    "The fix in 31.28 is in truth just a work-around and was unnecessary for all the years Youview's been in existance until April this year."

    How do you know that and why? Are you a test engineer? 
  • Tim CTim C Posts: 343Member ✭✭
    Visionman said:
    "I'd still love to know what was the cause of the failed recordings issue."

    Why? Would that help you in some way?
    Just because I'd like to know.
    Someone , somewhere changed something , be that Freeview, Youview or whoever.
    “Where’s ‘Jump to Time’ and all that other OldGen good stuff that was promised to come back, including the proper ‘Hide Channels’ etc etc.., rather than the unnecessary & unasked for that does get added and serves no useful purpose? Give me optional lists as well :) ."
  • dreamtimedreamtime Posts: 175Member
    Tim C said:
    Visionman said:
    "I'd still love to know what was the cause of the failed recordings issue."

    Why? Would that help you in some way?
    Just because I'd like to know.
    Someone , somewhere changed something , be that Freeview, Youview or whoever.
    It has to be a YouView issue. Previous updates not tested thoroughly enough.
  • Tim CTim C Posts: 343Member ✭✭
    Visionman said:
    "The fix in 31.28 is in truth just a work-around and was unnecessary for all the years Youview's been in existance until April this year."

    How do you know that and why? Are you a test engineer? 
    As it worked fine for years & suddenly something got changed somewhere - and it wasn't the box software - and clearly the change made hasn't been identified or corrected then any solution is a work-around and not a fix for the actual problem.
    I accept that maybe there was an issue with the Humax base software that the change brought to light, although that does surprise me somewhat as the original T1000 units were based on the HDR Fox-T2.
    “Where’s ‘Jump to Time’ and all that other OldGen good stuff that was promised to come back, including the proper ‘Hide Channels’ etc etc.., rather than the unnecessary & unasked for that does get added and serves no useful purpose? Give me optional lists as well :) ."
  • Tim CTim C Posts: 343Member ✭✭
    Roy said:
    Tim C said:

    What changed & where as only Youview units were affected?
    Probably because that is all that YouView provide?
    My point was that no other Freeview recorders seem to have been affected , suggesting to me that maybe something at the Youview server end changed. But who knows.
    “Where’s ‘Jump to Time’ and all that other OldGen good stuff that was promised to come back, including the proper ‘Hide Channels’ etc etc.., rather than the unnecessary & unasked for that does get added and serves no useful purpose? Give me optional lists as well :) ."
  • AnaglyptaAnaglypta Posts: 740Member ✭✭✭
    edited 4 September 2018, 12:50PM
    @Tim C and anyone else who missed it, Sarah posted the cause of failed recordings some time ago. If you follow the link all will be revealed, but nobody at YouView changed anything.
    I do note that you were a contributor to that thread Tim C, so perhaps you had forgotten.

    Hope this helps

    John.
    "Never tell people how to do things. Tell them what to do and they will surprise you with their ingenuity." - George S. Patton
  • RoyRoy Posts: 14,430Member ✭✭✭
    Service at the cafeteria was getting slower and slower.

    The diner at the Humax YouView table took to shouting “Where’s my dinner?” and stalking out in a huff, thus going hungry.

    The more patient diners waited a little longer, and were adequately fed.
    “Where’s ‘Jump to Time’ then? And all that other OldGen good stuff we were promised back, including the proper ‘Hide Channels’ and so on?” (Excerpt from ‘One Billboard Outside YouView Towers’, not coming soon to a box near you)
  • dreamtimedreamtime Posts: 175Member
    As long as you dont starve waiting for the dinner to be ready.
  • scottscott Posts: 1,835Member ✭✭✭
    A bit more detail was added here

    https://community.bt.com/t5/YouView-from-BT/Failed-Recording/td-p/1838724/page/54

    Hi everyone,

    Thanks for your considerable input to this issue. With the roll out of the software update to 100% of our set top boxes, we feel it’s the right time to lock this thread (although it will remain available for posterity). If you still have any issues then you’re welcome to create a new topic.

    For those with a technical interest – as we mentioned before the root of the issue was found within the set top box scheduling software (common to all STB types) which led to deadlocked or “empty” events being created for some scheduled recordings, even when they had previously worked before.

    Why that happened seems to have been due to an intermittent but persistent failure to deal with changes in EIT P/F information from the broadcast transmission data. The fix that has been implemented involved a significant rewrite of the scheduler code that will avoid these types of failures in the future.

    We’re sorry for any frustration you’ve had with recording, and really grateful to all who contributed comments or were involved in testing – thanks!

    Cheers

    DanielS

     

  • SarahSarah Posts: 888Administrator admin
    Hi all, 

    In regards to the HDMI/SCART topic, the bug fixed in 2014 on old-gen devices was specifically to address the menu graphics not displaying via SCART when a HDMI cable is also connected, but there was working AV. The changes required in recent software releases meant that some TVs may lose the ability to do the HDCP negotiation when both SCART and HDMI are connected, and hence results in no AV. 

    Connecting the box via both HDMI and SCART is not following the instructions in the manual, and isn’t the correct way to set up the box. As things have moved on a bit since 2014, and most people will be using HDMI only, we are not planning to address this issue for now.

    Thanks,

    Sarah


  • RoyRoy Posts: 14,430Member ✭✭✭
    Sarah said:
    Hi all, 

    In regards to the HDMI/SCART topic, the bug fixed in 2014 on old-gen devices was specifically to address the menu graphics not displaying via SCART when a HDMI cable is also connected, but there was working AV. The changes required in recent software releases meant that some TVs may lose the ability to do the HDCP negotiation when both SCART and HDMI are connected, and hence results in no AV. 

    Connecting the box via both HDMI and SCART is not following the instructions in the manual, and isn’t the correct way to set up the box. As things have moved on a bit since 2014, and most people will be using HDMI only, we are not planning to address this issue for now.

    Thanks,

    Sarah


    Hi Sarah

    It never occurred to me that someone might make both connections to the same TV at the same time, and I can well see why that might not work, even if I can’t see why someone might want to do it.

    My 2014 use case was to support a Slingbox off the SCART at the same time as supporting the local TV off the HDMI; can I take it that this would still work?

    Though as you say, things have moved on, and the Slingbox is now fed via an HDMI splitter it shares with the TV, and on through an HDMI to Component Video converter that lets the Slingbox send out 1080p, albeit from analogue.

    And moved on even further; a plethora of sticks and dongles, plus the greatly expanded catchup services we now have, over smart DNS, means the Slingbox link is not now used for much more than time-shifting movies recorded on YouView from terrestrial TV.
    “Where’s ‘Jump to Time’ then? And all that other OldGen good stuff we were promised back, including the proper ‘Hide Channels’ and so on?” (Excerpt from ‘One Billboard Outside YouView Towers’, not coming soon to a box near you)
  • RoyRoy Posts: 14,430Member ✭✭✭
    edited 5 September 2018, 4:25PM
    Oh, and according to these instructions:-

    If your TV doesn’t have an HDMI socket
    An HDMI cable gives the best picture and sound quality and is needed to watch in high definition (HD). It can be used with most modern TVs, but if your TV doesn’t have an HDMI socket, you can use a SCART cable (not supplied) to watch in standard definition instead.
    For help, go to bt.com/help/youview”

    that would imply that using a SCART cable to a set equipped with HDMI is likewise verboten, instead of just pointless (or possibly a solution for those with as many devices that they favour over YouView, or are HDMI-only, as their TV has HDMI inputs).

    Surely not?  :p
    “Where’s ‘Jump to Time’ then? And all that other OldGen good stuff we were promised back, including the proper ‘Hide Channels’ and so on?” (Excerpt from ‘One Billboard Outside YouView Towers’, not coming soon to a box near you)
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 9,002Member ✭✭✭
    Its like asking a new box today to support RF Modulation. Which none do. I also doubt future boxes (from anyone) will support SCART at all. If they even include it at all. I have a reticence about this, but thats just me.  
  • RoyRoy Posts: 14,430Member ✭✭✭
    edited 6 September 2018, 8:40AM
    Visionman said:
    Its like asking a new box today to support RF Modulation. Which none do. I also doubt future boxes (from anyone) will support SCART at all. If they even include it at all. I have a reticence about this, but thats just me.  
    A straw in the wind here is that the DTR-T4000 has no SCART socket. But other than this, none of us have future boxes, and some of us are still trying to keep six year old technology working, which is a reasonable past limit to work to, I think.

    You can get a digital RF modulator that will put a 1080p HDMI signal out as a digital DVB-T decodable Full HD signal for about £120. (Although the UK chose to put HD out on DVB-T2, you can perfectly well put it out on DVB-T, as they do in Spain, and even a YouView box can pull it in).

    So no need that RF modulating be a dead analogue thing. While a digital modulator costs about five times what an analogue one costs, anyone who wanted to integrate one into a volume product would need to bump the price up by a very great deal less than £120.




    “Where’s ‘Jump to Time’ then? And all that other OldGen good stuff we were promised back, including the proper ‘Hide Channels’ and so on?” (Excerpt from ‘One Billboard Outside YouView Towers’, not coming soon to a box near you)
  • VisionmanVisionman Posts: 9,002Member ✭✭✭
    Roy>
    "A straw in the wind here is that the DTR-T4000 has no SCART socket."

    Thats exactly my point.
  • Tim CTim C Posts: 343Member ✭✭
    edited 11 September 2018, 6:21PM
    Anaglypta said:
    @Tim C and anyone else who missed it, Sarah posted the cause of failed recordings some time ago. If you follow the link all will be revealed, but nobody at YouView changed anything.
    I do note that you were a contributor to that thread Tim C, so perhaps you had forgotten.

    Hope this helps

    John.
    Of course I was aware of this and what was given was more an explanation of what was happening, not really what the cause was or the origin of it.
    There were several methods available to prevent or atleast minimise these failures before 31.28 was released and in essence it was a case of preventing internet access either immediately when the units came out of standby or disabling standby altogether.
    Over the past couple of weeks I've been running 2 T4000 units on 26.41 & 26.42 that are totally disconnected from the internet , therefore no enhanced EPG etc and guess what?
    No failures on either unit.
    So to my way of thinking it must be the access to Youview's servers that is at the heart of the issue, either something has changed there or in the feed to them from outside sources.

    BTW I intend to make no further comment on this issue, you'll be pleased to know.
    “Where’s ‘Jump to Time’ and all that other OldGen good stuff that was promised to come back, including the proper ‘Hide Channels’ etc etc.., rather than the unnecessary & unasked for that does get added and serves no useful purpose? Give me optional lists as well :) ."
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