Multiple Recordings of Old Series When setting a Current Series Record

fre55die

Hi just a quick question to narrow down whether this is just a TT problem. When setting up a Series Recording on a number of channels I am getting old series included in the schedules. An example for tonight I set Murdoch Mysteries Series 12 as a series record on ALIBI. The box also decided that Series 8 should also be part of the schedule. This also is happening on several other channels randomly. The strangest one is NCIS Series 16 on FOX on Fridays. The box decides that NCIS older series on UNIVERSAL should also be included yet the repeats and re - runs of older series on FOX are not added. A number of people are reporting similar occurences and also this happening on non IP channels on the TT forums.

Any other fellow sufferers from NON TT users?

Roy

The mechanism here is that the boxes work off Series CRIDs and Programme CRIDs, coded identifiers in the programme metadata that identify a Series, for Series Record, and individual programmes by Programme CRID so the box does not record multiple showings of the same programme (e.g. SD or HD, or on a +1 Channel).

They do not use programme titles at all for this.

So you get what look like different Series to you, 12 or 8, because the same Series CRID has been assigned to both. For programmes on IP channels, any such error lies with the provider of these channels, so this is highly likely to be a TT-only problem.

For non-IP channels, any such error lies with the broadcaster(s) providing those channels. And probably would affect every Freeview or YouView recording device that had this Series set to record.

Unless TT is corrupting the metadata behind its EPG; that is possible, I suppose, but much less likely.

Though something that can trip people up is that irregardless of which programme you set a Series record from, perhaps a few days or a week, almost, in the future, it will pick up any programme with that Series CRID from the moment you set that recording; so they might get an earlier episode or two that they did not expect. But not, generally, from a completely different Series, unless the broadcaster has made an error.

But to act on this, chapter and verse is needed; what was the recording set for, and what did it actually get, dates times and channels affected in each case. Then TT or YouView can talk to the broadcaster, and get things put right. Hopefully those on the TT forums reporting such issues on non-IP channels are providing those details?

fre55die

Hi Roy

Thanks for that.

I just wondered if BT customers were having similar problems as I am guessing that they source the channels from the same supplier.

The 2 that threw me were the ones that I mentioned, especially the NCIS over 2 different broadcasters (although both I suspect sourced from Murdoch INC,)

Here A couple of further examples from the TT forum :

"I have the exact same problem.  I’ve set it to series record NCIS series 16 on Fox Friday at 2100. It has set to record this episode However it has decided to link series 10 being played on Universal.  No other series is set to record on any series on Fox or any other channel.  I could record series 15 last year and it only recorded series 15. Recorded NCIS New Orleans on Fox and it only recorded that season.

I have just installed my new box and it is doing the same. It’s going to get a bit annoying that you can’t record what you want  because an older series has grabbed the spot."

AND

"I'm getting this too on Sky1 and sky 2.

Every episode Hawaii 5-0 is being recorded, not just the current series. Also Delicious is double recording the same episode, early morning and evening on the day of broadcast.  I set it up on Sky 1, and it records all on 1&2.It seems as if this is an IPTV issue looking at the channels involved."

A real Murdoch Mystery EH !!

Roy

@fre55die

Heh heh. But no mystery as far as the mechanisms are concerned - just likely human error, given the way these CRIDs work.

CRIDs can’t be channel-specific, so that when, say, Homes Under The Hammer is moved from its regular BBC1 slot to BBC2 because of sport, the mechanism can still follow it there and record it.

Hence the only mystery in Fox and Universal programmes appearing together when the same Series CRID is in use for both (in error?) is the mystery of how the Series CRID duplication happened, and not of how it spreads across two channels.

Re the double Delicious, someone has given each episode a separate Programme CRID within the Series CRID; even the duplicates that ought to share the same Programme CRID, so only one copy is recorded. With the other being a fallback if the first showing isn’t recorded correctly.

Maybe one of them has AD, or signing, and the other doesn’t, so someone has misguidedly decided they are different, and so assigned different CRIDs? They are different, of course, if so, but not for Programme CRID purposes.

fre55die

Thanks Roy

As I said the two which threw me were the ones that I quoted, especially the NCIS on a completely different broadcaster (altogether although I suspect both sourced from Messrs.MURDOCH INC). I gather that one other major one with several reports from the forum :

"Re: Series Record out of control!

I'm getting this too on Sky1 and sky 2.

Every episode Hawaii 5-0 is being recorded, not just the current series. Also Delicious is double recording the same episode, early morning and evening on the day of broadcast.

It seems as if this is an IPTV issue looking at the channels involved."

AND

"I have the exact same problem.  I’ve set it to series record NCIS series 16 on Fox Friday at 2100. It has set to record this episode However it has decided to link series 10 being played on Universal.  No other series is set to record on any series on Fox or any other channel.  I could record series 15 last year and it only recorded series 15. Recorded NCIS New Orleans on Fox and it only recorded that season.

I have just installed my new box and it is doing the same. It’s going to get a bit annoying that you can’t record what you want  because an older series has grabbed the spot."

It really is a "Murdoch Mystery" eh !!

fre55die

Thanks Roy

As I said the two which threw me were the ones that I quoted, especially the NCIS on a completely different broadcaster (altogether although I suspect both sourced from Messrs.MURDOCH INC). I gather that one other major one with several reports from the forum :

"Re: Series Record out of control!

I'm getting this too on Sky1 and sky 2.

Every episode Hawaii 5-0 is being recorded, not just the current series. Also Delicious is double recording the same episode, early morning and evening on the day of broadcast.

It seems as if this is an IPTV issue looking at the channels involved."

AND

"I have the exact same problem.  I’ve set it to series record NCIS series 16 on Fox Friday at 2100. It has set to record this episode However it has decided to link series 10 being played on Universal.  No other series is set to record on any series on Fox or any other channel.  I could record series 15 last year and it only recorded series 15. Recorded NCIS New Orleans on Fox and it only recorded that season.

I have just installed my new box and it is doing the same. It’s going to get a bit annoying that you can’t record what you want  because an older series has grabbed the spot."

It really is a "Murdoch Mystery" eh !!

Rob P

Just regarding Delicious, I've seen some odd behaviour on this on my Sky box also. It picked up the new series automatically as I had recorded previous ones, but it's been a mess; it's got some episodes twice and missed at least one altogether.

Roy

Rob P said:

Just regarding Delicious, I've seen some odd behaviour on this on my Sky box also. It picked up the new series automatically as I had recorded previous ones, but it's been a mess; it's got some episodes twice and missed at least one altogether.

Cheers @Rob P, you have reminded me of another Series CRID consideration.

When a Series finishes, the details vanish off your box, but the CRID remains stored for 13-17 weeks, and will ‘wake up’ if further programmes appear with that CRID.

This allows for the Series Recording of monthly programmes, like The Sky At Night used to be, where the forward EPG never covers the gap.

CRIDs aren’t supposed to be reused for different Series until that 17 weeks is up; but if it’s the same Series as it was before, and you have cleared all the past episodes off your box, then it will start recording them again.

This can cause you to think that a new schedule entry for a different Series, which correctly has a different CRID, is also re-recording the old Series; but it isn’t, it’s the earlier schedule entry come back to life, which you can check by looking at the schedule on the box, where you will see two upcoming entries, one for the old series and one for the new.

At which point, you can delete the resurrected entry for the old series; something you can’t do while it’s dormant (indeed, you can’t even see it) but which I think you ought to be able to do.

I was going to refer to the enhancement request for this in @Keith’s excellent list of these, but I can’t find it there...