BT are still telling customers they have to return their YouView box

2»

Comments

  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    @karlosfannyos

    So 13 December 2019 was the ownership to loanership switch date.

    Useful to know.
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • joneshjonesh Member, Super User Posts: 1,679 ✭✭✭
    Roy said:
    jonesh said:
    Could it be that the new T&Cs come into force as soon as you are out of contract?
    Complicated - BT can’t make retrospective T&Cs, so that an owned box under the old rules becomes a loaned box under the new rules,
    Our T1000 just breathed a sigh of relief :D.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    jonesh said:
    Roy said:
    jonesh said:
    Could it be that the new T&Cs come into force as soon as you are out of contract?
    Complicated - BT can’t make retrospective T&Cs, so that an owned box under the old rules becomes a loaned box under the new rules,
    Our T1000 just breathed a sigh of relief :D.
    Better make sure it wasn’t its last sigh.....😈
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • joneshjonesh Member, Super User Posts: 1,679 ✭✭✭
    That's a very cruel thing to say, @Roy. It might be old, but it still has feelings :'(.
  • I've just quit my BTTV as the price was going up and I don't really use it much, hardly at all recently.  I just have too many other streaming services and can get most of their content elsewhere.  Should have done it ages ago but the price increase was the tipping point.

    Anyway, after giving me the runaround and trying to imply that I'd have to do a new contract because the TV was originally part of the order (it wasn't, I added it to my old ADSL long before I went to Fibre) and then changing their stance when I said if I had to cancel I'd just switch providers for the new contract ....  they said I'd have to return my box.

    I said "Pretty sure it's mine to keep" but they were adamant it had to come back.  This is a Humax DTR2100 that I got back in 2015 and it was advertised as yours to keep once the contract period was up.

    Not sure what they are going on about - I don't use the PVR that much any more but it is nice to have the Youview functionality still for the few times I watch terrestrial TV.

    I might kick up a fuss about it - pretty rich trying to claim back stuff that they don't own and you can't change a contract retroactively to own something.  Let's see if they actually send a box for me to return it.
  • joneshjonesh Member, Super User Posts: 1,679 ✭✭✭
    They'll probably send you a bag, but ignore them. It's your box. 
  • jonesh said:
    They'll probably send you a bag, but ignore them. It's your box. 

    I've received two already. 
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    I've just quit my BTTV as the price was going up and I don't really use it much, hardly at all recently.  I just have too many other streaming services and can get most of their content elsewhere.  Should have done it ages ago but the price increase was the tipping point.

    Anyway, after giving me the runaround and trying to imply that I'd have to do a new contract because the TV was originally part of the order (it wasn't, I added it to my old ADSL long before I went to Fibre) and then changing their stance when I said if I had to cancel I'd just switch providers for the new contract ....  they said I'd have to return my box.

    I said "Pretty sure it's mine to keep" but they were adamant it had to come back.  This is a Humax DTR2100 that I got back in 2015 and it was advertised as yours to keep once the contract period was up.

    Not sure what they are going on about - I don't use the PVR that much any more but it is nice to have the Youview functionality still for the few times I watch terrestrial TV.

    I might kick up a fuss about it - pretty rich trying to claim back stuff that they don't own and you can't change a contract retroactively to own something.  Let's see if they actually send a box for me to return it.
    I keep correcting that ‘advertised as yours to keep once the contract period was up’, and it’s probably worth getting right.

    The box was yours from Day 1, and only stopped being yours if you sent it back under the cooling off arrangements. But you did have a financial liability to BT, progressively reducing throughout the contract period until it was zero at the end of it.

    And if you stopped paying part way through, then BT could, and would, come after you for that money. But they could never come after you to get the box back, because it simply wasn’t theirs, it was yours.

    And this arrangement applies to every agreement by which a YouView box was supplied, up until 13 December 2019 when, for agreements taken out on and after that date only, BT started retaining ownership of the boxes.

    Any attempt by BT to get you to send back a box you obtained from them before that date is a potentially fraudulent act - and explicitly fraudulent if there is any attempt at coercion - and an offence, or perhaps multiple offences, under the Fraud Act 2006.
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,299 ✭✭✭
    BT advisors read from a pop-up on screen script that tells them what to say. But the on screen script has no idea when you bought your box. So if you entered into contract with BT before Dec 13th 2019 the box is yours to keep (and was from day 1).

    If anyones getting extra hassle about this, its best to register and post on the BT YouView forum and contact a Mod, who will take up the case on your behalf until its resolution.

    The BT forum can be found here -
    https://community.bt.com/t5/YouView-from-BT/bd-p/YouView

    Hope that helps.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    @Visionman

    What happened to ‘innocent until proven guilty’?

    If BT are indeed using a script which makes their agents engage in fraudulent behaviour towards a significant proportion of the customers they contact *, then BT need to carry out a wholesale revision of the script to avoid putting their agents, and themselves, in danger of accusations of fraud, going forward.

    * Though I am assuming this is just supposition on your part, and you don’t really know if in fact this is the case. Not least because any script must surely be leaving gaps for the insertion of contingent information from the customers’ records, which you might hope would include the start date of any agreement under which a YouView box was supplied.

    A date which the customer should challenge the agent to supply, and point out if it was prior to 13/12/2019
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • DarrenDarren Member, Super User Posts: 651 ✭✭
    edited 17 September 2020, 8:41AM
    Im lucky BT gave me the main Youview box that I using the back in 2018 and the BT Youview retail box I have in my bedroom is from 2017. After the the original Youview box that I had packed in.
    I was offered a Youview T4000 box when i changed my TV package to Now TV Big Entertainment but never tane the box.
    I will however have to send back the Home Hub6(smart Hub) that they sent me end of last year to replace the Home Hub 4 that I was using. if I ever had to leave BT. 
    Been fully back with BT for over 30 years and think the only part of the BT service that I now hardly use is the phoneline to make calls.
    I seem to find it depends who you get on the end of the phone. As I spoke to two guys this year and they have both not said they same thing.
  •   Well I've now received the bag - they apparently do expect me to send back my 2015 Humax Youview DVR box which was at the time explicitly stated as being the property of the subscriber after the contract was up.

      I will now have to phone them up and get this sorted before they start hassling me and ding my credit record.  What a disorganised shower.  They offer a decent technical service but any time I've had occasion to call them to rectify something, there is nothing but hassle and confusion usually meaning I waste anything up to an hour getting annoyed before I finally get put through to someone who knows what they are talking about.....
  • kodikidkodikid Member Posts: 1,075 ✭✭
    Morning. I wouldn't waste time hanging on the telephone constantly hearing your call is important to us🤔.
    This is a standard automated response so just ignore it.
    Doubt if they will take it any further but if they do ask to speak to a manager as the average call centre worker will probably be script driven by current and in your case wrong information and demand it back with the odd threat thrown in.
    The box is yours. 
    Good luck
    Deacon Blue hit from October 88
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
      Well I've now received the bag - they apparently do expect me to send back my 2015 Humax Youview DVR box which was at the time explicitly stated as being the property of the subscriber after the contract was up.

      I will now have to phone them up and get this sorted before they start hassling me and ding my credit record.  What a disorganised shower.  They offer a decent technical service but any time I've had occasion to call them to rectify something, there is nothing but hassle and confusion usually meaning I waste anything up to an hour getting annoyed before I finally get put through to someone who knows what they are talking about.....
    @YouwithaView

    Probably worth getting right if you are going toe to toe with BT - the box was yours from Day 1, not from when the contract was up.
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • benetobeneto Member Posts: 1
    Having been with bt for many years I've decided to move on now being out of contract.
    They have sent me an email saying they are sending me a return bag for my 4k tv box, if not sent back before the 13th Jan 2023 then I will be charged £115 for it.
    It's OK saying its our box but bt will just take the amount out of my bank account if I don't send it back won't they. 
  • Tim CTim C Member, Super User Posts: 614 ✭✭
    All depends when your box was actually received by you.
    If it was before 13/12/2019 then it is yours to keep otherwise they are correct.
    Best to post over on the BT Community forum and maybe a moderator will offer assistance.

  • kodikidkodikid Member Posts: 1,075 ✭✭
    Hi

    Did you get your box before December 2019?.

    If you received it after this date then BT are legally entitled to get there box back and press for payment for non return. 

    There is limited traffic on this site and I have no recollection of anyone here being "forced " to cough up for not returning the equipment 

    You might be better asking this question on the BT youview forum to test the water.

    Deacon Blue hit from October 88
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    @beneto

    Yes, find out the start date of the contract under which you were sent the YouView box in question, bearing in mind that it might have been an upgrade from an earlier box.

    If this was indeed 13/12/2019 or later, then bear in mind that the £115 isn’t ‘for’ the box. It’s a Non-Return Fee, and doesn’t transfer ownership of the box to you; it remains BT’s property.

    You then have two years in which to send the box back to BT, and if you do, they will refund you the fee.

    It is not recorded what happens if you keep the box longer than that…..

    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • DarrenDarren Member, Super User Posts: 651 ✭✭
    edited 17 November 2022, 10:20AM
    I left BT TV nearly 8 months ago and went with Now direct.
    Was at the time told I needed to send my BT Youview box back and was also sent an email about it and posted a returns bag but I have still not sent the box back and BT have not done anymore about it being returned.
    I now looking at all my options as my BT FTTC contract is up near the end of February next year and still not decided if I will be stayed with BT.
    Also FTTP is come to my area in the first half of next year. Going by the Openreach website and depending on price may also think about moving from FTTC to FTTP.
    They have already started digging up parts of the town centre for FTTP.


  • kodikidkodikid Member Posts: 1,075 ✭✭
    edited 17 November 2022, 3:02PM
    Darren said:
    I left BT TV nearly 8 months ago and went with Now direct.
    Was at the time told I needed to send my BT Youview box back and was also sent an email about it and posted a returns bag but I have still not sent the box back and BT have not done anymore about it being returned.
    I now looking at all my options as my BT FTTC contract is up near the end of February next year and still not decided if I will be stayed with BT.
    Also FTTP is come to my area in the first half of next year. Going by the Openreach website and depending on price may also think about moving from FTTC to FTTP.
    They have already started digging up parts of the town centre for FTTP.


    Hi Darren
    Re FTTP

    Finally getting FTTC on Tuesday..going from 11 mbps to supposedly 150 mbps download speed. 

    My BT ADSL has never really been an issue with a super strong signal..

    just can't use too many devices simultaneously and of course no 4k.

    My point is this

    I've heard all the delights of FTTP but at what point does maga ultra road runner coyote fast become surplus to requirements?

    My analogy would be like ownership of a Ferrari in a urban environment. 

    Would you simply be paying for something you're never likely to use to it's full capacity?
    Deacon Blue hit from October 88
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    edited 18 November 2022, 9:34AM
    Darren said:
    I left BT TV nearly 8 months ago and went with Now direct.
    Was at the time told I needed to send my BT Youview box back and was also sent an email about it and posted a returns bag but I have still not sent the box back and BT have not done anymore about it being returned.
    I now looking at all my options as my BT FTTC contract is up near the end of February next year and still not decided if I will be stayed with BT.
    Also FTTP is come to my area in the first half of next year. Going by the Openreach website and depending on price may also think about moving from FTTC to FTTP.
    They have already started digging up parts of the town centre for FTTP.


    @Darren

    BT used to send out weasel-worded letters about returning boxes, to subscribers who cancelled BT TV while retaining a YouView box BT had supplied to them before 13/12/2019.

    The box of course belonged to the subscriber, and had done so from the day it was delivered from BT, but if challenged, BT would say it was merely ‘offering to assist the user if they wanted to recycle the box’.

    And so the email could safely be ignored.

    Is this the situation you are in? Can you post the text of the email, with personal data suitably redacted, so we can see if it is the old text, the post-13/12/2019 text, or some other variant?

    Re FTTP, EE are advertising on Smooth Radio to the effect that EE FTTP is up to five times more reliable than EE FTTC. I believe them. EE is of course now a BT brand,
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭

    @kodikid asks:-

    Would you simply be paying for something you're never likely to use to its full capacity?

    I have 500 Mbps, of which I get 350 at best, and 60 at worst. I don’t notice any issues, and can still get 4K UHD streaming in the room with the 60 Mbps.

    I have a BT mesh repeater I could set up to improve that 60, but I have never needed to. Perhaps if we had a gamer in the house we might need this, though.

    You won’t know yourself with your 150 Mbps when it arrives, but check the drop off in rooms furthest from the router.
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • DarrenDarren Member, Super User Posts: 651 ✭✭
    @Roy will have to look out the email as it was about  6 months ago since I got it.
    will have a look at EE. I have also looked at Sky and Vodafone. Have even though of staying with BT.
    Seen two Openreach vans in my area the day and a Kerr van. No digging up of streets near me just in town centre but a new phone poll has now gone up in the park just behind me about 5 doors from me.
Sign In or Register to comment.