BT Humax YouView box ITV hub problem after adverts

JOESJOES Member Posts: 11
program cuts off after adverts; intermittent problem. Humax box is connected to a Toshiba TV via HDMI.  BBC iPlayer has no problems at all; the problem with ITV hub is related to adverts.
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  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    @JOES

    The adverts come from a different server from the programmes, and the apps for the commercial channels never have the slightest problem switching to the ad servers, but seem to encounter difficulties switching back afterwards.

    Which seems strange, unless you follow the money….

    The BBC iPlayer is unaffected because it never switches in this way, not even for its programme trails.
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • JOESJOES Member Posts: 11
    Could ITV be doing this deliberately, I wonder, so that more and more people pay not to have the adverts?
    A lot a people with Sony TVs have had this issue it would appear, but my TV is not Sony it is Toshiba, and the connection to broadband, via ethernet cable, is from the BT Humax YouView box, not from the tv.  So, in my view, this must be an issue caused by ITV.  I have no problem at all from my laptop to ITV hub via the same router wirelessly.
  • JOESJOES Member Posts: 11
    It appears that this issue is affecting a very large number of people, perhaps ITV should give viewers, using ITV hub from a TV or YouView box, a no charge access to advert free tv until the problem is fixed.
  • JOESJOES Member Posts: 11
    It appears, from a search of previous discussions, that the problem of programmes cutting off after adverts has been going on since 2017, so why have ITV not yet fixed the issue?  It is extremely frustrating when, having watched most of a detective programme that you never get to find out who the murderer was.  I have spent ages trying repeatedly to restart Midsomer Murders from where it cuts off, adverts are replayed but the programme rarely restarts.  If you are very lucky you sometimes see the whole of a programme.
    When did the option of advert free ITV first become available?  Does it coincide with when this problem began?
  • kodikidkodikid Member Posts: 1,074 ✭✭
    Is your Humax recordable?
    ITV are not the only culprits,  channel 5 aspires to woeful and don't get me started on UKTV.
    To me the terrestrial catch ups are a bonus, if there is something I really want to see then I record it.
    I suggest going forward you do the same.
    Deacon Blue hit from October 88
  • SarahSarah Member Posts: 1,812 admin
    JOES said:
    program cuts off after adverts; intermittent problem. Humax box is connected to a Toshiba TV via HDMI.  BBC iPlayer has no problems at all; the problem with ITV hub is related to adverts.
    Hi @JOES
    Welcome to the forum :) 
    Can you please let us know the box model you are using and the software versions it's running on? These can be found by going to Settings > Box information and Software Information. It'd also be helpful to know some examples of pieces of content this has been happening on so we can test this and if you've noticed this issue only occurring after certain adverts as well. 
    Thanks,
    Sarah
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    edited 24 August 2021, 5:30PM
    JOES said:
    Could ITV be doing this deliberately, I wonder, so that more and more people pay not to have the adverts?
    A lot a people with Sony TVs have had this issue it would appear, but my TV is not Sony it is Toshiba, and the connection to broadband, via ethernet cable, is from the BT Humax YouView box, not from the tv.  So, in my view, this must be an issue caused by ITV.  I have no problem at all from my laptop to ITV hub via the same router wirelessly

    @JOES

    If the issue is caused by ITV, then why is it OK from your laptop? You could equally deduce from the above that the YouView box, or at least the app on it, is at fault.

    But neither explains the widespread nature of this problem, nor it cropping up from so many broadcasters on so many platforms.

    But ITV must know that for every one person who subscribes to get over the issue, there are likely ten who just give up watching catchup on the ITV Hub, which reflects into the audience figures ITV can offer advertisers, and therefore the rates they can charge.

    Not fixing this, right across the industry, is a completely false economy.
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • JOESJOES Member Posts: 11
    What you have said makes good sense; my suggestion that it has been left unfixed deliberately was a bit tongue-in-cheek.
    However, it seems very odd that this problem has existed since 2017 and has not yet been fixed.

  • JOESJOES Member Posts: 11
    Sarah said:
    JOES said:
    program cuts off after adverts; intermittent problem. Humax box is connected to a Toshiba TV via HDMI.  BBC iPlayer has no problems at all; the problem with ITV hub is related to adverts.
    Hi @JOES
    Welcome to the forum :) 
    Can you please let us know the box model you are using and the software versions it's running on? These can be found by going to Settings > Box information and Software Information. It'd also be helpful to know some examples of pieces of content this has been happening on so we can test this and if you've noticed this issue only occurring after certain adverts as well. 
    Thanks,
    Sarah
    Hello Sarah,

    Thank you for your reply.  Here is the information you have requested:
    Manufacturer: Humax
    Model: DTRT2100
    Variant: 84B08500
    Last checked for update: 24 Aug. 2021
    Last checked for apps: 24 Aug 2021
    Component software: 3.7.112 (2a7476)
    Manufacturer software: 32.115/0
    Platform configuration: 4810 (8b7c7887)
    ISP configuration: 17
    It is set to install updates automatically where possible.

    the problem occurs very frequently when watching Midsomer Murders catch up episodes, originally shown on ITV3 and ITV3+1.
    I don't use other catch up tv very much, just BBC iPlayer and ITV Hub.

    I would be very grateful if you could fix this issue; it is extremely frustrating having to use the laptop to watch the end of programmes, when it is not possible on the TV with the external Humax box.
    I am not certain, but I think that the problem may be worse when the pause function has been used during the programme.

    Kind regards,
    Joe.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    JOES said:
    What you have said makes good sense; my suggestion that it has been left unfixed deliberately was a bit tongue-in-cheek.
    However, it seems very odd that this problem has existed since 2017 and has not yet been fixed.

    Yes, I got the tongue in cheek 😛

    I suspect that the various broadcaster catchup services are all using only one or two CDNs, Akamai perhaps or AWS. And the process of stopping a stream, inserting the ads, which are likely to be more or less individually tailored, and then getting back to the stream when they have been shown, is a tricky configuration problem for the broadcasters, probably exacerbated by some weaknesses in the code that achieves all this, quite apart from it nor being very automated, nor easy to use.

    But I can remember a time when ITV was pretty good, but All4 was all over the shop, playing a game of whack-a-mole where it would finally fix its player on one device, only them to see the problem move to their player on another device.

    So black box analysis was telling me that there were two aspects to this; one, getting the ‘lane changing’ right on the CDNs, and two, driving the ‘lane changing’ correctly in each individual app.

    Now, All4 Is pretty good, but ITV are playing whack-a-mole. What’s the betting that when the ITV Hub starts behaving itself on your YouView box, the problem won’t move to your currently working laptop app?
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • JOESJOES Member Posts: 11
    Sarah,
    I am getting the problem when trying to watch an episode of Midsomer Murders called "Worm in the Bud".  When I choose "Resume" there is an ad. for Viking Cruises, and then soon afterwards the programme drops out and kicks me out of the iTV Hub and back to live TV.  It does it every time.
    Joe.
  • JOESJOES Member Posts: 11
    Sarah,
    Sometimes the problem is at the end of the adverts, but sometimes at the beginning; the Viking Cruises ad. may be significant because it is played at the start and at the end of the adverts; it says "Viking sponsors classic drama" and then, shortly afterwards, you are dropped back to live TV, the ITV Hub connection is lost.
    Perhaps other people could try the same episode of Midsomer Murders; I have the same issue with other episodes, but not all; the common factor between episodes with problems was/is Viking Cruises, I believe.
    Joe.
  • SarahSarah Member Posts: 1,812 admin
    Thanks for all the detail @JOES, we'll have a go at testing this on a few devices on our end to see if we can replicate it. Just to clarify, does this happen on the ads before the programme starts as well or just the ones at the ad breaks during the programme? 

    Thanks,
    Sarah
  • JOESJOES Member Posts: 11
    Sarah said:
    Thanks for all the detail @JOES, we'll have a go at testing this on a few devices on our end to see if we can replicate it. Just to clarify, does this happen on the ads before the programme starts as well or just the ones at the ad breaks during the programme? 

    Thanks,
    Sarah
    Hello Sarah,
    I don't remember it ever happening before the programme starts, but I will perform some further tests.  It is after watching some of the programme at the start or at the end of ad. breaks, just after the Viking Cruises sponsor for "Classic Drama". So your testers will need to watch some of the programme.  Try pausing and skipping backwards and forwards too, that may make the issue worse (not sure about this).  Also, exit the ITV Hub then reconnect and choose to "Resume" the episode.  I currently have the problem every time when resuming a particular episode.
  • JOESJOES Member Posts: 11
    JOES said:
    Sarah said:
    Thanks for all the detail @JOES, we'll have a go at testing this on a few devices on our end to see if we can replicate it. Just to clarify, does this happen on the ads before the programme starts as well or just the ones at the ad breaks during the programme? 

    Thanks,
    Sarah
    Hello Sarah,
    I don't remember it ever happening before the programme starts, but I will perform some further tests.  It is after watching some of the programme at the start or at the end of ad. breaks, just after the Viking Cruises sponsor for "Classic Drama". So your testers will need to watch some of the programme.  Try pausing and skipping backwards and forwards too, that may make the issue worse (not sure about this).  Also, exit the ITV Hub then reconnect and choose to "Resume" the episode.  I currently have the problem every time when resuming a particular episode.
    It is not happening today! I have just tried it again and the problem is not happening now. Last night it happened every time; perhaps it only happens when many people are accessing the ITV Hub at the same time?
  • SarahSarah Member Posts: 1,812 admin
    Hi @JOES

    Thanks for this information.

    We've managed to replicate the issue a few times on different Midsomer Murders episodes on ITV Hub so we've raised it with our Content Team who will reach out to ITV so they can investigate. We'll let you know if we have any updates :) 

    Thanks for raising this with us,
    Sarah
  • SarahSarah Member Posts: 1,812 admin
    Hi @JOES
    Just to update, ITV have resolved this issue. I've tested a few Midsomer Murders episodes and haven't been able to replicate this issue again so it does look like it's been fixed as expected. 
    Please let us know if you encounter the same issue at all and we can look into it further :) 
    Thanks,
    Sarah
  • FelixFelix Member Posts: 13
    Sarah said:
    Hi @JOES
    Just to update, ITV have resolved this issue. I've tested a few Midsomer Murders episodes and haven't been able to replicate this issue again so it does look like it's been fixed as expected. 
    Please let us know if you encounter the same issue at all and we can look into it further :) 
    Thanks,
    Sarah
    Hi Sarah,

    I'm seeing the same problem now when trying to watch some ITV Hub programmes.  Sanditon and McDonald & Dodds are the current culprits. The adverts start (usually Dominos pizza) then as it goes to the programme it fails with an 'whoops, what's going on here?' message. Occasionally the programme will eventually start after a long wait but then it will fail after the first set of adverts.

    Manufacturer: Humax
    Model: HDR-1100S
    Software version UKSFAA 3.01.01
    Update Date 24th May 2022
    MICOM version UKSFAA 8.04.01

    I've done all the usual things - reboot box, re-enter ITV Hub code.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    edited 10 July 2022, 12:22PM
    Felix said:
    Sarah said:
    Hi @JOES
    Just to update, ITV have resolved this issue. I've tested a few Midsomer Murders episodes and haven't been able to replicate this issue again so it does look like it's been fixed as expected. 
    Please let us know if you encounter the same issue at all and we can look into it further :) 
    Thanks,
    Sarah
    Hi Sarah,

    I'm seeing the same problem now when trying to watch some ITV Hub programmes.  Sanditon and McDonald & Dodds are the current culprits. The adverts start (usually Dominos pizza) then as it goes to the programme it fails with an 'whoops, what's going on here?' message. Occasionally the programme will eventually start after a long wait but then it will fail after the first set of adverts.

    Manufacturer: Humax
    Model: HDR-1100S
    Software version UKSFAA 3.01.01
    Update Date 24th May 2022
    MICOM version UKSFAA 8.04.01

    I've done all the usual things - reboot box, re-enter ITV Hub code.
    Hi Felix

    According to my researches that’s not a YouView box, and not even a Freeview one - it’s a Humax Freesat box. So while the itv Hub app on there is via the internet, it won’t be quite the same as the itv Hub app on YouView boxes.

    So any help we could give you would likely be very limited, apart from saying yes, streaming players are notorious for doing this, and mysteriously never have any trouble going to the adverts, just coming back afterwards.

    Try posting on 
    https://myhumax.org/forum/
    and see what they have to say.

    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • FelixFelix Member Posts: 13
    Roy said:
    Felix said:
    Hi Felix

    According to my researches that’s not a YouView box, and not even a Freeview one - it’s a Humax Freesat box. So while the itv Hub app on there is via the internet, it won’t be quite the same as the itv Hub app on YouView boxes.

    So any help we could give you would likely be very limited, apart from saying yes, streaming players are notorious for doing this, and mysteriously never have any trouble going to the adverts, just coming back afterwards.

    Try posting on 
    https://myhumax.org/forum/
    and see what they have to say.

    Dang you're correct!

    I'll try the Humax forum. Interesting that these problems are occurring on different systems...
  • John LJohn L Member, Super User Posts: 902 ✭✭
    Felix said:
    Roy said:
    Felix said:
    Hi Felix

    According to my researches that’s not a YouView box, and not even a Freeview one - it’s a Humax Freesat box. So while the itv Hub app on there is via the internet, it won’t be quite the same as the itv Hub app on YouView boxes.

    So any help we could give you would likely be very limited, apart from saying yes, streaming players are notorious for doing this, and mysteriously never have any trouble going to the adverts, just coming back afterwards.

    Try posting on 
    https://myhumax.org/forum/
    and see what they have to say.

    Dang you're correct!

    I'll try the Humax forum. Interesting that these problems are occurring on different systems...
    [email protected],
    I have the same Freesat PVR and it does the same thing from time to time. Youview sails along with minimum fuss, compared to the 1100s. I tend to find Youview are more reliable, software updated more regularly, so I use Youview more for using Apps.

    Have you got a Youview PVR to use? If not, can highly recommend getting yourself one. The 2100/4000 models can easily be obtained online, but no longer sold brand new. John L
    Can't wait for the day when Youview get rid of the dreaded darkened banner when using fast forward/rewind recordings. 
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    edited 10 July 2022, 2:29PM
    John L said:
    Felix said:
    Roy said:
    Felix said:
    Hi Felix

    According to my researches that’s not a YouView box, and not even a Freeview one - it’s a Humax Freesat box. So while the itv Hub app on there is via the internet, it won’t be quite the same as the itv Hub app on YouView boxes.

    So any help we could give you would likely be very limited, apart from saying yes, streaming players are notorious for doing this, and mysteriously never have any trouble going to the adverts, just coming back afterwards.

    Try posting on 
    https://myhumax.org/forum/
    and see what they have to say.

    Dang you're correct!

    I'll try the Humax forum. Interesting that these problems are occurring on different systems...
    [email protected],
    I have the same Freesat PVR and it does the same thing from time to time. Youview sails along with minimum fuss, compared to the 1100s. I tend to find Youview are more reliable, software updated more regularly, so I use Youview more for using Apps.

    Have you got a Youview PVR to use? If not, can highly recommend getting yourself one. The 2100/4000 models can easily be obtained online, but no longer sold brand new. John L
    Needs a terrestrial aerial though, at least to tune it in.
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • FelixFelix Member Posts: 13

    [email protected],
    I have the same Freesat PVR and it does the same thing from time to time. Youview sails along with minimum fuss, compared to the 1100s. I tend to find Youview are more reliable, software updated more regularly, so I use Youview more for using Apps.

    Have you got a Youview PVR to use? If not, can highly recommend getting yourself one. The 2100/4000 models can easily be obtained online, but no longer sold brand new. John L
    Thanks, this stuff is pretty flaky it seems.

    I have an ITV app on my TV, I might try that if it can't be fixed. Though it needs a cable running to my network switch.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,591 ✭✭✭
    edited 11 July 2022, 6:20AM
    Felix said:
    Roy said:
    Felix said:
    Hi Felix

    According to my researches that’s not a YouView box, and not even a Freeview one - it’s a Humax Freesat box. So while the itv Hub app on there is via the internet, it won’t be quite the same as the itv Hub app on YouView boxes.

    So any help we could give you would likely be very limited, apart from saying yes, streaming players are notorious for doing this, and mysteriously never have any trouble going to the adverts, just coming back afterwards.

    Try posting on 
    https://myhumax.org/forum/
    and see what they have to say.

    Dang you're correct!

    I'll try the Humax forum. Interesting that these problems are occurring on different systems...
    @Felix

    It’s a common (in the sense of shared) problem. To show you ads, the stream from the content provider has to stop, the stream from the ad provider has to be picked up, and when it’s finished, the stream from the content provider has to be restarted.

    All of which is a dance between the app and the providers, and if the right triggers aren’t sent at the right time this will fail, without necessarily any fault in the app. Sure, the app can be sent the right triggers, and fail to action them, in which case the app will need revising, but quite often, the issue is with the content provision.

    All4 had a torrid six months where every time they fixed the above issue on the app on a certain device, the app on some other device would start to fail instead. Which showed that likely All4 were addressing the issues by changing how the content side worked, as if they had fixed the app on a certain device, this wouldn’t have had the problem skittering onto other devices, which couldn’t handle the content side changes that fixed the first device,

    Here’s Amazon’s puff for how AWS handles ads:-
    https://aws.amazon.com/blogs/media/how-to-implement-reliable-dynamic-ad-insertion-using-aws-media-services/

    It reads like borderline gibberish to me, but I suppose it means something to the people who do this for a living…….
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • FelixFelix Member Posts: 13
    Well it seems that the Humax forum isn't as active as this one - no answer...

    I've emailed Humax support, if I get an answer, I'll post it here for info
  • joneshjonesh Member, Super User Posts: 1,679 ✭✭✭
    Felix said:

    [email protected],
    I have the same Freesat PVR and it does the same thing from time to time. Youview sails along with minimum fuss, compared to the 1100s. I tend to find Youview are more reliable, software updated more regularly, so I use Youview more for using Apps.

    Have you got a Youview PVR to use? If not, can highly recommend getting yourself one. The 2100/4000 models can easily be obtained online, but no longer sold brand new. John L
    Thanks, this stuff is pretty flaky it seems.

    I have an ITV app on my TV, I might try that if it can't be fixed. Though it needs a cable running to my network switch.
    Presumably you are using your box's WiFi.
    Try connecting it using a cable. It might solve the problem.
  • FelixFelix Member Posts: 13
    jonesh said:
    Presumably you are using your box's WiFi.
    Try connecting it using a cable. It might solve the problem.
    Sadly, it already cabled.
  • joneshjonesh Member, Super User Posts: 1,679 ✭✭✭
    Felix said:
    jonesh said:
    Presumably you are using your box's WiFi.
    Try connecting it using a cable. It might solve the problem.
    Sadly, it already cabled.
    Ah. :)
  • FelixFelix Member Posts: 13
    Actually just had a email back - very quick - asking me to test other apps to see if they work. Presumably checking my internet connection. iPlayer, MY5, Netflix all work fine
  • FelixFelix Member Posts: 13
    This doesn't look too good - blame the other guy

    Thank you, I am not sure if you are aware, that ITV are making huge software changes to there Apps, meaning sometime this year, for all older models including Humax, the ITV will be no longer available, you will still be able to access some programmes with those issues occurring, by all means we are not the ones that are removing it, that is ITV's doing.
     
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