Removal of Delete Confirmation mildly deprecated

RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,376 ✭✭✭
edited 6 March 2017, 10:48PM in Archived Posts
The removal of Delete Confirmation in the recent update is mildly deprecated.

The consequences of this, which I was somewhat apprehensive about - namely the accidental deletion of more than one recording at a time due to the absence of the Confirmation, and of any other indication that deletion is taking place - have occurred, making me a little disappointed.

I hope that in future, wiser counsel will prevail over the inadvisability of this change, and it will be reversed in the next update.

The provision of a user setting to choose whether Confirmation is to be required or not would be an equally satisfactory outcome here.

For the future, the ability to mark several recordings to be removed in a single deletion might be advantageous.

And the use of a Trash Bin, from which deleted recordings could be resurrected unless and until they were removed by auto-deletion, for which the Trash Bin should be the first port of call before other recordings are considered, would be the sine qua non.
‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
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Comments

  • gomezgomez Member Posts: 2,073 ✭✭
    edited 6 March 2017, 10:48PM
    Boy! You don't hold back do you? Fergy and his hair dryer have nothing on you!
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,376 ✭✭✭
    edited 7 December 2016, 8:38AM
    gomez said:

    Boy! You don't hold back do you? Fergy and his hair dryer have nothing on you!

    There's a YVM104 on the hairdryer :-)

    This zephyr breeze is its arguably gentler replacement
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • Andrew MalloyAndrew Malloy Member Posts: 1
    edited 26 September 2013, 8:33AM
    I found out that deletion confirmation had been removed when I accidentally deleted a programme. No idea what programme it was, but it's gone. I would much prefer the option to enable or disable this.
    Also, the menu functionality has changed going into my recordings. You used to have to press up, as with many of the other menus, now you have to press ok. Can we either go back to the old way, or have all menus the same please?
    thanks
  • edited 21 November 2012, 7:25PM

    I found out that deletion confirmation had been removed when I accidentally deleted a programme. No idea what programme it was, but it's gone. I would much prefer the option to enable or disable this.
    Also, the menu functionality has changed going into my recordings. You used to have to press up, as with many of the other menus, now you have to press ok. Can we either go back to the old way, or have all menus the same please?
    thanks

    Hi

    the menu change was made because people complained of the number of key presses needed to get to the recordings list.
  • AnotherJohnHAnotherJohnH Member Posts: 36
    edited 26 August 2015, 4:39PM
    Given the choice, I would be happier with a one click deletion provided there was an option to undelete.

    However the undelete option/choice is implemented, (be it trashcan with admin privileges to keep minors off deleted adult content), or whatever the brains trust can come up with.
  • Simon RobinsonSimon Robinson Member Posts: 6
    edited 17 December 2012, 11:12PM
    The recent software update is great... however is it possible to re-implement the confirmation message when you delete recordings? It's too easy to accidentally delete recordings now.

    This reply was created from a merged topic originally titled
    Delete confirmation has gone!.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,376 ✭✭✭
    edited 6 March 2017, 10:48PM
    For those who have noticed the changed title of this thread, it isn't that the Removal of Delete Confirmation has lost a little of its value - though arguably the YV box has, unless and until Delete Confirmation comes back - it's that I frowned upon this change.

    The 'i' offends me, and I've asked that it be plucked out.... :-))
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • Steve RobertsSteve Roberts Member Posts: 3
    edited 18 December 2012, 6:08PM
    We strongly disagree with the removal of the confirmation before delete button!!

    The other day we were trying to delete the programme we had watched. Nothing seamed to be happening when my wife was trying it so I then tried it and pressed it a few more times... Then all of a sudden it seam to process all our requests at once and half a dozen programmes dissapeared before our eyes!!

    This coupled with the other reported issue that reset the whole box and deleted ALL the programmes when we turned it on earlier means we have deleted more programmes than we have watched in the six days of ownership!!
  • Ian BetteridgeIan Betteridge Member Posts: 5
    edited 18 December 2012, 6:08PM
    It's far to easy to delete in error, surely an "are you sure" button should be added
  • Carl AldertonCarl Alderton Member Posts: 19
    edited 31 July 2013, 6:07PM
    I agree - bring back the delete confirmation option. I've done the same as others mentioned and deleted recordings by mistake. It's VERY frustrating.
  • Rob WassellRob Wassell Member Posts: 1
    edited 18 December 2012, 6:08PM
    Strongly agree that confirmation should be sought as its too easy to accidentally delete a recording. I hope the Youview admins are reading this so that it can be re-added to the next update.
  • twelve stockstwelve stocks Member Posts: 33
    edited 18 December 2012, 6:08PM
    I also prefer a confirmation.....This proves that you can please some of the people all the time.......etc etc
  • Bilbo BagginsBilbo Baggins Member Posts: 177
    edited 6 December 2012, 8:15PM
    I don't know if our newer forum members have read this (welcome, by the way! we are growing a nice community here), but top tip is to Lock a recording you would like to keep with the Yellow button in YourView recordings, that way, it brings up the "Are you sure" dialogue box before auto-delete.
    HTH
  • tim freertim freer Member Posts: 7
    edited 7 December 2012, 12:04AM
    Still think it is better than the old system that was very user unfriendly but confirmation of delete is good, if possible. Great to find an organisation that listens and updates software automatically.
  • Carl AldertonCarl Alderton Member Posts: 19
    edited 31 July 2013, 6:07PM
    bilbo- new forum members or not but removal of delete confirmation is plain stupid especially when sometimes you are in doubt when the box has accepted the button and then deletes the next recorded programme. Yes you may be able to protect recorded programmes from being deleted but let's just get real here and realise that youview has made a very uninformed decision by removing this confirmation option. Most people won't ever use the protect option from deletion in everyday use. YouView need to LISTEN to their user community.
  • Neil3Neil3 Member Posts: 16
    edited 18 December 2012, 6:09PM
    agreed to easy to delete. not yet in the hands of my 6 year old. just waiting for all manner of things to be deleted.
  • Bilbo BagginsBilbo Baggins Member Posts: 177
    edited 7 December 2012, 4:11PM

    bilbo- new forum members or not but removal of delete confirmation is plain stupid especially when sometimes you are in doubt when the box has accepted the button and then deletes the next recorded programme. Yes you may be able to protect recorded programmes from being deleted but let's just get real here and realise that youview has made a very uninformed decision by removing this confirmation option. Most people won't ever use the protect option from deletion in everyday use. YouView need to LISTEN to their user community.

    I did not say I agree with it, but it doesn't affect me, I just let the box do what it does, when the HDD reached 100% full, I left the BT Humax box to delete stuff itself
  • marcusd666marcusd666 Member Posts: 14
    edited 18 December 2012, 6:09PM
    Please can we have the confirm delete option back as it's to easy to delete programs by mistake or at least have an option to turn it on.

    This was one of the reasons I left sky.
  • northernnorthern Member Posts: 241
    edited 22 February 2017, 6:07PM
    n
  • AxolotlAxolotl Member Posts: 53
    edited 18 December 2012, 6:09PM
    Absolutely agree that removing delete confirmation was a step in the wrong direction.

    I thought I'd imagined that it used to be there, as I haven't had the YV box long and I'm still getting used to its many failings... adding new ones really doesn't make me want to use it.
  • bob fenwickbob fenwick Member Posts: 6
    edited 18 December 2012, 5:56PM

    I found out that deletion confirmation had been removed when I accidentally deleted a programme. No idea what programme it was, but it's gone. I would much prefer the option to enable or disable this.
    Also, the menu functionality has changed going into my recordings. You used to have to press up, as with many of the other menus, now you have to press ok. Can we either go back to the old way, or have all menus the same please?
    thanks

    How many people, does the minority rule or are they too lazy to press abutton?
  • bbbukbbbuk Member Posts: 4
    edited 14 January 2013, 10:01PM
    I too have just accidently deleted a recording.

    Having just read that a, "are you sure" prompt was there in the past but has been removed in a firmware/software update due to demand (I assume) then the only way to please those that want a "are you sure" prompt and those that don't is to have in the settings whether to enable "are you sure" prompt.

    This way those that would like it (me being one) can enable it and those that prefer to have one press to delete something can disable the prompt.
  • AxolotlAxolotl Member Posts: 53
    edited 29 December 2012, 1:31PM
    bbbuk said:

    I too have just accidently deleted a recording.

    Having just read that a, "are you sure" prompt was there in the past but has been removed in a firmware/software update due to demand (I assume) then the only way to please those that want a "are you sure" prompt and those that don't is to have in the settings whether to enable "are you sure" prompt.

    This way those that would like it (me being one) can enable it and those that prefer to have one press to delete something can disable the prompt.

    I agree. There seem to be a lot of areas where YouView designers are choosing things that should be left to user options.in the "settings" area. By all means have YouView select default settings, but let users override them if they feel more comfortable doing things differently.
  • Neil DaviesNeil Davies Member Posts: 14
    edited 30 December 2012, 10:21AM
    Just to add, we've now had several accidental deletion of 2 programs. This was down to the speed of the box during deleting; You're not sure if it took your command, so press the button again, then it deletes 2 recordings.
    Please please please tell me the prompt will be brought back........
  • gomezgomez Member Posts: 2,073 ✭✭
    edited 30 December 2012, 10:45AM
    I have now adopted the habit of locking new recordings then unlocking them after I have watched them. As has been my want I only delete recordings more than a week old so the lock symbol makes it easier to spot those I have still to watch compared to reading the cumbersome WATCHED/UNWATCHED statuses. But when deleting several recordings at a time I use the Dads Army drill and have a built in wait: Delete, Two,Three, ...
  • Leigh SmithLeigh Smith Member Posts: 14
    edited 30 December 2012, 1:14PM
    I think a good option would be to have a settings option where you can choose
    delete confirmation or not. In other words you could request automatic program lock. I have also lost a recording due to no confirmation. Not good.
  • KeithKeith Member, Super User Posts: 2,450 ✭✭✭
    edited 4 March 2017, 10:29AM
    Given that the removal of this option received negative feedback within hours of the features software update on 30/10/2012 and has continued to receive negative feedback since I would be surprised if YouView do absolutely nothing about it by the next features update which is likely to happen in January (so hopefully at most a month away now).

    As well as this topic about the issue there are also lots of comments and feedback on the change within these topics: On the undelete topic I have previously given my thoughts on what they could do now which is basically in line with many of the other comments people have made, i.e. bring back the confirmation step but then make an option to disable it for those that want to (i.e. the default behaviour would be safe again but for those that want speed over safety they can turn it off although they would be better served if they also then had an undelete option to recover from any occasional mistakes).

    Whilst I would think reenabling the confirmation step and even adding an option to disable it, for those that do not want it, was quick and straight forward there may still be reasons why YouView do not do this for the January update. If that is the case and nothing changes though in the January update I would hope YouView would post on the forum further information about what they are doing and hence their view/perspective on the issue, e.g. they could post to say an undelete option is in development and will be available in say April (which seems unlikely) or they could post to say despite the general majority view on the forum that the removal of the confirmation step is bad that their wider testing and customer feedback shows a strong preference for the current setup.

    Overall though I would simply hope that as a bare minimum in the next update they make the confirmation step an option and thus fairly easily address the issue in a way that can work well for all users.
  • edited 30 December 2012, 4:14PM
    Keith1 said:

    Given that the removal of this option received negative feedback within hours of the features software update on 30/10/2012 and has continued to receive negative feedback since I would be surprised if YouView do absolutely nothing about it by the next features update which is likely to happen in January (so hopefully at most a month away now).

    As well as this topic about the issue there are also lots of comments and feedback on the change within these topics:

    On the undelete topic I have previously given my thoughts on what they could do now which is basically in line with many of the other comments people have made, i.e. bring back the confirmation step but then make an option to disable it for those that want to (i.e. the default behaviour would be safe again but for those that want speed over safety they can turn it off although they would be better served if they also then had an undelete option to recover from any occasional mistakes).

    Whilst I would think reenabling the confirmation step and even adding an option to disable it, for those that do not want it, was quick and straight forward there may still be reasons why YouView do not do this for the January update. If that is the case and nothing changes though in the January update I would hope YouView would post on the forum further information about what they are doing and hence their view/perspective on the issue, e.g. they could post to say an undelete option is in development and will be available in say April (which seems unlikely) or they could post to say despite the general majority view on the forum that the removal of the confirmation step is bad that their wider testing and customer feedback shows a strong preference for the current setup.

    Overall though I would simply hope that as a bare minimum in the next update they make the confirmation step an option and thus fairly easily address the issue in a way that can work well for all users.
    Hi Keith

    Why do you suggest implementing an undelete option by April is "unlikely" but that it's possible they'll have coded an option to enable/disable the OK prompt in less time?
  • KeithKeith Member, Super User Posts: 2,450 ✭✭✭
    edited 21 December 2016, 11:30PM
    Keith1 said:

    Given that the removal of this option received negative feedback within hours of the features software update on 30/10/2012 and has continued to receive negative feedback since I would be surprised if YouView do absolutely nothing about it by the next features update which is likely to happen in January (so hopefully at most a month away now).

    As well as this topic about the issue there are also lots of comments and feedback on the change within these topics:

    On the undelete topic I have previously given my thoughts on what they could do now which is basically in line with many of the other comments people have made, i.e. bring back the confirmation step but then make an option to disable it for those that want to (i.e. the default behaviour would be safe again but for those that want speed over safety they can turn it off although they would be better served if they also then had an undelete option to recover from any occasional mistakes).

    Whilst I would think reenabling the confirmation step and even adding an option to disable it, for those that do not want it, was quick and straight forward there may still be reasons why YouView do not do this for the January update. If that is the case and nothing changes though in the January update I would hope YouView would post on the forum further information about what they are doing and hence their view/perspective on the issue, e.g. they could post to say an undelete option is in development and will be available in say April (which seems unlikely) or they could post to say despite the general majority view on the forum that the removal of the confirmation step is bad that their wider testing and customer feedback shows a strong preference for the current setup.

    Overall though I would simply hope that as a bare minimum in the next update they make the confirmation step an option and thus fairly easily address the issue in a way that can work well for all users.
    Hi Martin - Since the undelete function topic is currently not even marked as under consideration I think it is less likely to get implemented in the short term, i.e. they will have already frozen what is in any January update and will most likely have already broadly fixed what they intend to implement for the following update around April time. Whilst an undelete function relates to the issue of deleting recordings it is really a separate feature and there is some careful/detailed technical work to be done to implement it fully/well. I do think an undelete function is well worth having in the long run as even when one intentionally deletes something occasionally later that is realised to be a mistake (e.g. someone else in the household wanted to watch it too and being able to undelete it could quickly solve the problem). So just because there is no indication YouView are even considering the undelete function idea at the moment I do believe they could possibly implement and test such a feature by the end of April if they decide it is appropriate to do so (based against their general development roadmap, other features and bugs they wish to address, resources they have available, feedback from customers and other test groups they may have etc).

    From my experience making a change such as making the delete confirmation step an option still involves some work but is a more manageable task in a short time frame and well worth doing to address this issue. Also they have had quite a lot of feedback on this since 30/10/2012 so could well in response to that and a wider review of such a feature have already scheduled in such work between then and January or failing that April.

    I do agree with you that simply making things an option is not always a good idea and thus one should not simply do that when there may be better or more efficient solutions. In this case though I think that ultimately having the confirmation step as optional and having an undelete feature would be the best longer term objective.
  • edited 30 December 2012, 5:08PM
    Keith1 said:

    Given that the removal of this option received negative feedback within hours of the features software update on 30/10/2012 and has continued to receive negative feedback since I would be surprised if YouView do absolutely nothing about it by the next features update which is likely to happen in January (so hopefully at most a month away now).

    As well as this topic about the issue there are also lots of comments and feedback on the change within these topics:

    On the undelete topic I have previously given my thoughts on what they could do now which is basically in line with many of the other comments people have made, i.e. bring back the confirmation step but then make an option to disable it for those that want to (i.e. the default behaviour would be safe again but for those that want speed over safety they can turn it off although they would be better served if they also then had an undelete option to recover from any occasional mistakes).

    Whilst I would think reenabling the confirmation step and even adding an option to disable it, for those that do not want it, was quick and straight forward there may still be reasons why YouView do not do this for the January update. If that is the case and nothing changes though in the January update I would hope YouView would post on the forum further information about what they are doing and hence their view/perspective on the issue, e.g. they could post to say an undelete option is in development and will be available in say April (which seems unlikely) or they could post to say despite the general majority view on the forum that the removal of the confirmation step is bad that their wider testing and customer feedback shows a strong preference for the current setup.

    Overall though I would simply hope that as a bare minimum in the next update they make the confirmation step an option and thus fairly easily address the issue in a way that can work well for all users.
    Hi thanks for the response.

    YouView will of course do what they want, but I can't see how an optional confirmation prompt is necessary with an undelete facility, if you can recover a deleted recording why sod about configuring whether to be askd if you're really sure you want to delete it?

    So If they are intending to add an undelete facility in the next 12 months I'd hope they just revert wholesale to the old OK prompt in the meantime rather than spend any time developing what would soon become a redundant feature.

    I've always been clear it was a daft move to remove the prompt before an undelete feature was added - I consider one to be a pretty basic feature on a modern family PVR - and I hope YouView will have learnt a valuable lesson about speeding too far ahead of customer wants and expectations so that this sort of thing doesn't happen in future.

    On the subject of options, I think they can be overused and cause too much complication for users and support desks and can be eliminated in many cases with compliment features.

    The above is a good example IMO.
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