New BT YouView Box with new features and wifi onboard,to give multi room abilm capabilty a and WIFi?

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  • KeithKeith Member, Super User Posts: 2,448 ✭✭✭
    edited 5 June 2021, 11:52AM
    Visionman said:
    @Keith Whoa not seen you for a while! Nice to see you.
    Thanks @Visionman !
    I'm still following everything, and testing where involved, but overall it seems there is rarely anything worth me commenting on, or chipping in with, here publicly these days, so I am content to be a largely silent observer. It would be so much more pleasing of course if that were because YouView was truly outstanding and there is only so much praise one can give; that said my T2000 is still the best box I have had, just so far continuing to fall short of the full potential I (and others) saw back in 2012 (and continue to see).
    There are of course other what ultimately turn out to be dead ends that other much more functional products have hit over the years - I never had a Toppy but by all accounts it was feature rich; I still have some logitech squeezebox players which continue to perform excellently despite logitech killing the product line a number of years ago. Measuring success by longevity, profit/income (well for BT anyway) or customer base, YouView is not doing too bad so far - I'll keep watching and be interested to see what happens next  ;)

  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 16,803 ✭✭✭
    Visionman said:
    @Roy Sorry if your uncomfortable with that word but whilst your reply was interesting you didn't answer the question. So have you decided to get one or not? 
    @Visionman

    Not uncomfortable at all, thanks.

    But you first - I asked you what difference it would make if I answered Yes rather than No?

    So I need that answer before I can properly answer the substantive question.
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭
    Well the universe wouldn't stop rotating.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 16,803 ✭✭✭
    Visionman said:
    Well the universe wouldn't stop rotating.
    Do you have a frame of reference that suggests it does?
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭
    edited 5 June 2021, 2:17PM
    Yet again you avoid the question.... Quite sad.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 16,803 ✭✭✭
    Visionman said:
    Yet again you avoid the question.... Quite sad.
    Surely no different from you avoiding mine?

    How true it is, though, that when you point the finger at someone else, you have three fingers pointing back at yourself 😛

    But when you are done with Cosmology 101, perhaps you could cobble up some sort of a response?
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭
    edited 5 June 2021, 3:00PM
    What was the question again? That I actually asked?
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 16,803 ✭✭✭
    Visionman said:
    What was the question again? That I actually asked?
    B*ggered if I can remember 😛
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭
    LOL
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • John LJohn L Member, Super User Posts: 822 ✭✭
    My main question would be what real advantage does the new box give? Yes, it can upscale to 4k, bigger harddrive, maybe brilliant news for VIP BT new customers that are attracted to tones of movies, extra subscription channels (if you have enough time to watch everything) for "only" £65 per month. Be interested to see if this eventually goes retail. There is still competition out there: Manhattan, Humax Aura, Freesat with their newer model.

    It's encouraging that "they still make pvrs", a brave prediction of the current technology market. Hopefully the market will pick up again, as consumers realize the convenience of being able to record, alongside the facility of catch-up streaming. I agree with @keith with regards trialing a box. I wouldn't race out to purchase one, just to get the latest gadget. Do we know if the new box has same software as the current Youview models? John L
    Can't wait for the day when Youview get rid of the dreaded darkened banner when using fast forward/rewind recordings. 
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 16,803 ✭✭✭
    edited 6 June 2021, 10:23PM
    @John L

    The T4000, one of which I possess, can upscale to 4K (which it does rather badly), and show 4K material natively, so this isn’t new.

    WiFi is new, or would be if it had it, and will be when (if?) it gets it*, but is only new on YouView boxes, as just about everything else in the world has it - though my Hive Hub and my Hue Hub soak up the remaining spare ports on my Home Hub, even now.

    But existing YouView box owners considering a switch already have a wired Ethernet link in place, so no advantage or disadvantage here.

    HDR is new to YouView; but again, anything with HDR I can get on several TVs and devices that I own.

    As to recordings, I can match the 1TB and four recording streams on this box, albeit that this needs two of my current YouView boxes to do it. Neither of which has HDR, and only one has 4K, but there is nothing to record in 4K and/or HDR anyway. And the potential clash of remotes, solved by using Bluetooth on the new box, is solved by my having the two YouView boxes in different rooms - low-tech, but effective.

    So I would not spend money on one of these new boxes, even if they trickle down to lower tiers than the VIP level.

    Unless I have missed something they can do that I absolutely can’t do now, one way or another?

    As regards retail, official or  eBay/Amazon, my hunch is that BT will keep tight control over these boxes, and they will be BT TV-only, returnable if your subscription lapses, and I wouldn’t be at all surprised if they did the old BT Vision trick of stopping working if the subscription was ceased. 

    So far, I think no-one has said this is the case, but they haven’t said it isn’t, either,

    *YouView initially promised that you could record from YouView on Sony Android TVs, and then found themselves quite unable to come good on this promise, even though they have had six years to address this.

    If it matters to them, customers should seek financially-backed assurances that WiFi will be delivered, or compensation made.

    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • robotmanrobotman Member Posts: 192
    New box on the way - Page 3 - BT Community
    This is the first YouView box to be completely spec'd by BT, exclusively for BT, designed with BT requirements in mind (current and future)
    posted by DarrenDev, part of the BT team
    "Flash, Flash, I love you, but we only have 14 hours to save the Earth"
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭
    @Roy "As regards retail, official or  eBay/Amazon, my hunch is that BT will keep tight control over these boxes, and they will be BT TV-only, returnable if your subscription lapses, and I wouldn’t be at all surprised if they did the old BT Vision trick of stopping working if the subscription was ceased."

    That is the case. They will be rental only.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • kodikidkodikid Member Posts: 650 ✭✭
    The reason apparently WiFi is delayed is it will be programed to work only with the new smart 3 hub which will be announced in the autumn. 
    Effectively these boxes will then not work wirelessly unless connected to a BT 3 smart hub.
    Obviously all future new tv deals will include both pro box and smart hub 3.
    Ignore this if you disagree. 
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 16,803 ✭✭✭
    kodikid said:
    The reason apparently WiFi is delayed is it will be programmed to work only with the new smart 3 hub which will be announced in the autumn. 
    Effectively these boxes will then not work wirelessly unless connected to a BT 3 smart hub.
    Obviously all future new tv deals will include both pro box and smart hub 3.
    Thanks @kodikid

    Can you quote a source for this information, so we can judge for ourselves how much weight to give it?

    Its also not clear what, if any, is your own further speculation above. Are BT shipping only T4000 boxes at the moment, or are T2xxx boxes, maybe even including the zappers, still being issued?

    If so, there may still be such tiers in future also, unless BT really want to lock down their new customers, and lock down the supply and use of these new boxes.

    And if they do, then I think they would go a great deal further than just locking the boxes’ WiFi to Hub 3s, by locking the boxes to BT, or even to BT TV.
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • kodikidkodikid Member Posts: 650 ✭✭
    edited 6 June 2021, 9:16AM
    Morning Roy.
    ISP review mentioned the new smart hub 3 being the possible reason for the delay in making  its WiFi  debut. 
    At the moment BT are still offering the T4000 on it's VIP pack.
    The zapper is also still available as a second muti room box to the T4000. 
    Ignore this if you disagree. 
  • robotmanrobotman Member Posts: 192
    @Roy
    And if they do, then I think they would go a great deal further than just locking the boxes’ WiFi to Hub 3s, by locking the boxes to BT, or even to BT TV
    *See my post above

    @kodikid
    At the moment BT are still offering the T4000 on it's VIP pack
    *So when can new customers to VIP ACTUALLY expect this new box to be shipped with new VIP subs? Is it in reality launched or not?
    "Flash, Flash, I love you, but we only have 14 hours to save the Earth"
  • kodikidkodikid Member Posts: 650 ✭✭
    edited 6 June 2021, 11:31AM
    My bad,
    It is available now.
    As a existing BT subscriber I looked on MY BT and obviously it's not available to me as an existing customer, but it is to new subscribers of its VIP pack.
    Ignore this if you disagree. 
  • robotmanrobotman Member Posts: 192
    kodikid said:
    My bad,
    It is available now.
    As a existing BT subscriber I looked on MY BT and obviously it's not available to me as an existing customer, but it is to new subscribers of its VIP pack.
    This is what it shows on MY BT
    BT TV Box
    That of course is the T4000 (is it not?).
    Don't think I'd risk ordering it just yet!!!
    "Flash, Flash, I love you, but we only have 14 hours to save the Earth"
  • stereohavenstereohaven Member Posts: 65
    Nice looking box and long overdue. Glad to see YouView as an OS lives on.

    I also look forward to BT customers trying to record 4 multicast delivered channels, while also watching Disney+ via the app on their TV with the kids upstairs watching YouTube on their mobile devices, all on a 40Mbps FTTC connection.

    This box appears to be built to benefit from a service the Openreach network will be unable to deliver for a good few years yet. Good for you if you have the benefit of FTTH/P, but so many still don’t, where is the scalability without the infrastructure?

    At the end of the day this is still Freeview with apps, all of which you can get in the same picture quality, for less money and without a contract right now. 

    BT have said on their own forum in the past that all of the data they have shows clearly the move away from using PVRs and customers watching via on demand or streaming. They even used it to explain why they dropped the HDD size on the T4000 from 1TB down to 500GB!

    So what do BT do? Release a new box with more tuners, over a year late that doesn’t function fully and does nothing anyone with a decent smart TV can do now, for less money. Bizarre.
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭
    For me, the move to a 1Tb four tuner box is a surprise to be sure.

    @scott can you shed any light on this? Without breaking any NDAs of course.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭
    stereohaven 
    "So what do BT do? Release a new box with more tuners, over a year late that doesn’t function fully and does nothing anyone with a decent smart TV can do now, for less money. Bizarre."

    Thats an interesting point of view. Though the year late was beyond their control. Apparently theres something called Covid knocking around. And for info - smart TVs don't in any way compare to PVRs.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • stereohavenstereohaven Member Posts: 65
    Visionman said:
    And for info - smart TVs don't in any way compare to PVRs.
    I wasn't comparing a smart TV to a PVR (although many can record), I was referring to BT's own data showing that their customers are moving to streaming and using catch up services rather than PVR functionality.

    Something any half decent Freeview Play TV set can do with it's eyes closed.
  • John LJohn L Member, Super User Posts: 822 ✭✭
    Visionman said:
    And for info - smart TVs don't in any way compare to PVRs.
    I wasn't comparing a smart TV to a PVR (although many can record), I was referring to BT's own data showing that their customers are moving to streaming and using catch up services rather than PVR functionality.

    Something any half decent Freeview Play TV set can do with it's eyes closed.

    @stereohaven
    As far as I know, Smart TV's that can still record, can only record one channel at a time. What do you do if you want to record another channel at same time. Yes, use either a pvr or use streaming to catch up later (maybe with adverts to wade through).

    Streaming may be popular, but hopefully, they will still produce devices to cater for everyone's tastes. Both have their pros and cons. I also use streaming, but mainly for YouTube and a few TV apps when something hasn't recorded, or I forgot to record. 
    John L


    Can't wait for the day when Youview get rid of the dreaded darkened banner when using fast forward/rewind recordings. 
  • scottscott Member, Super User Posts: 2,128 ✭✭✭
    edited 6 June 2021, 8:43PM
    stereohaven de said:
    Nice looking box and long overdue. Glad to see YouView as an OS lives on.

    I also look forward to BT customers trying to record 4 multicast delivered channels, while also watching Disney+ via the app on their TV with the kids upstairs watching YouTube on their mobile devices, all on a 40Mbps FTTC connection.

    This box appears to be built to benefit from a service the Openreach network will be unable to deliver for a good few years yet. Good for you if you have the benefit of FTTH/P, but so many still don’t, where is the scalability without the infrastructure?

    At the end of the day this is still Freeview with apps, all of which you can get in the same picture quality, for less money and without a contract right now. 

    BT have said on their own forum in the past that all of the data they have shows clearly the move away from using PVRs and customers watching via on demand or streaming. They even used it to explain why they dropped the HDD size on the T4000 from 1TB down to 500GB!

    So what do BT do? Release a new box with more tuners, over a year late that doesn’t function fully and does nothing anyone with a decent smart TV can do now, for less money. Bizarre.
    I haven’t tried recently but I believe the four tuners is slightly misleading as you can still only record two IP channels (even with my 300mbps connection :(), you can record four broadcast channels or two broadcast channels and two IP channels. I can quite happily record the 4k channel, a HD ip channel, two broadcast channels and watch Netflix while the lad plays a game on the ps5 and the missus watches YouTube :)

    I do find it amusing that everyone screams for a new box and when it is released complain that there is no point in it. Can smart TVs search all the content? Catch up still leaves a lot to be desired with some still not playing in HD and still not allowing you to skip adverts. Also it is not easy to record the F1 and start watching it half an hour after it’s original start time on a smart tv ;)
    I think the best points of the new box over the standard 4k box will come later.
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,117 ✭✭✭
    Whats misleading about that?
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • scottscott Member, Super User Posts: 2,128 ✭✭✭
    Visionman said:
    Whats misleading about that?
    Just in case you think 4 tuners would allow you to record 4 IP channels at once. I assumed I could but then maybe that is just me lol.
  • stereohavenstereohaven Member Posts: 65
    John L said:
    As far as I know, Smart TV's that can still record, can only record one channel at a time. What do you do if you want to record another channel at same time. Yes, use either a pvr or use streaming to catch up later (maybe with adverts to wade through).

    Streaming may be popular, but hopefully, they will still produce devices to cater for everyone's tastes. Both have their pros and cons. I also use streaming, but mainly for YouTube and a few TV apps when something hasn't recorded, or I forgot to record. 
    John L
    So buy a PVR then, plenty available to choose from for a one off cost and then use the apps in the PVR, TV or another device as required.

    No long term contract and you can avail yourself of the numerous deals (especially on NOW memberships), or pause them as you see fit.
  • scottscott Member, Super User Posts: 2,128 ✭✭✭
    edited 6 June 2021, 9:30PM
    John L said:
    As far as I know, Smart TV's that can still record, can only record one channel at a time. What do you do if you want to record another channel at same time. Yes, use either a pvr or use streaming to catch up later (maybe with adverts to wade through).

    Streaming may be popular, but hopefully, they will still produce devices to cater for everyone's tastes. Both have their pros and cons. I also use streaming, but mainly for YouTube and a few TV apps when something hasn't recorded, or I forgot to record. 
    John L
    So buy a PVR then, plenty available to choose from for a one off cost and then use the apps in the PVR, TV or another device as required.

    No long term contract and you can avail yourself of the numerous deals (especially on NOW memberships), or pause them as you see fit.
    Which PVR shows me BT Sports in 4k HDR Dolby Atmos that I can record to watch later please.
    I appreciate everyone uses things differently and you pay your money and take your choice. The VIP option isn’t actually that bad a price if you add up the three now passes (sorry membership) and boost plus the BT Sports and Eurosport’s channels in HD (you can get offers on it also) but appreciate that isn’t for everyone.
  • redchizredchiz Member, Super User Posts: 5,185 ✭✭✭
    scott said:
    Which PVR shows me BT Sports in 4k HDR Dolby Atmos that I can record to watch later please.
    You've got to admit that's a hell of a niche market.
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