Com 7 switchoff

zulu17zulu17 Member, Super User Posts: 1,121 ✭✭✭
With the upcoming COM7  switchoff  is there a need to do a manual retune on any of the Youview box models or will the process be automatic and the channels that are ceasing and those that are changing to a different existing Freeview multiplex or changing LCN (channel number) seamlessly be reflected in the EPG.

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  • John LJohn L Member, Super User Posts: 888 ✭✭
    edited 26 June 2022, 10:38AM
    Hi @zulu17,
    Good question, on everyone's mind at the moment (well anyone that's aware/interested). I would assume that the boxes automatically update over night, but I will be checking each Youview PVR, plus also all of our Freeview equipment, including TV tuners to see what they do/may do a manual tune.

    Don't forget that the TV's may not update automatically depending on how up to date they are, or when replugged in start updating channels.
    Some TV's will have to be manually retuned.  I know our Samsung 4k TV updates during the day as it's unplugged overnight. It's going to be an interesting week on the forum! . . . "I have a Youview that can't get channels". John L 
    Can't wait for the day when Youview get rid of the dreaded darkened banner when using fast forward/rewind recordings. 
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,520 ✭✭✭
    edited 26 June 2022, 10:53AM
    @zulu17 @John L

    I have found that while the YouView box is better than our Samsung TV was at following channel changes, it’s not perfect.

    Some channels get replaced just fine, some get the replacement channel slotted in OK, but the channel that was on that LCN goes and lives above 790, and doesn’t disappear until you retune.

    And I have seen the odd one that even YouView couldn’t cope with.

    We are enjoined to retune both on the 29th and on the 30th, and I will be including our YouView boxes in that process, along with all the TVs in the house, as usual.

    Its not like it’s hard to do, as long as you take care not to interrupt any recording schedule you may have going, though rather disappointingly, Freeview have not suggested a suitable time of day for the retune:-

    https://www.freeview.co.uk/help/service-updates/channel-changes-closures-freeview-june-2022

    We get our TV from Rowridge, but don’t currently get BBC4 HD. I will be interested to see if it appears for us in the relevant retune, as it will be increasing its power. It’s not hard for us to switch to Freesat to watch it in HD if we are so inclined, but it would be nice to be able to record it.

    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • John LJohn L Member, Super User Posts: 888 ✭✭
    @Roy, sounds good advice. I will be busy retuning equipment around house. Might take a few hours!
    John L
    Can't wait for the day when Youview get rid of the dreaded darkened banner when using fast forward/rewind recordings. 
  • kodikidkodikid Member Posts: 1,044 ✭✭
    A channel retune never hurts and dosnt take long.
    Deacon Blue hit from October 88
  • John LJohn L Member, Super User Posts: 888 ✭✭
    edited 26 June 2022, 11:57AM
    kodikid said:
    A channel retune never hurts and dosnt take long.
    @kodikid, it depends how many pvrs, TV's you have around the home. Might also have to reschedule some of recordings. Oh what fun we are going to have!
    John L
    Can't wait for the day when Youview get rid of the dreaded darkened banner when using fast forward/rewind recordings. 
  • joneshjonesh Member, Super User Posts: 1,655 ✭✭✭
    zulu17 said:
    With the upcoming COM7  switchoff  is there a need to do a manual retune on any of the Youview box models or will the process be automatic and the channels that are ceasing and those that are changing to a different existing Freeview multiplex or changing LCN (channel number) seamlessly be reflected in the EPG.
    I have never manually re-tuned our Youview box. When there have been changes to the Freeview channel line-up in the past it has always updated its Guide automatically.
    I'll leave it alone and see how it gets on this time. :)
  • DarrenDarren Member, Super User Posts: 639 ✭✭
    Only once I have manually retuned the Youview box.
    Think this is a step back for Freeview with the the lose of yet more HD versions of channels.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,520 ✭✭✭
    jonesh said:
    zulu17 said:
    With the upcoming COM7  switchoff  is there a need to do a manual retune on any of the Youview box models or will the process be automatic and the channels that are ceasing and those that are changing to a different existing Freeview multiplex or changing LCN (channel number) seamlessly be reflected in the EPG.
    I have never manually re-tuned our Youview box. When there have been changes to the Freeview channel line-up in the past it has always updated its Guide automatically.
    I'll leave it alone and see how it gets on this time. :)
    @jonesch

    Can you have a quick peek above 733 on your YouView EPG and see if there is anything there?
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • joneshjonesh Member, Super User Posts: 1,655 ✭✭✭
    Roy said:
    jonesh said:
    zulu17 said:
    With the upcoming COM7  switchoff  is there a need to do a manual retune on any of the Youview box models or will the process be automatic and the channels that are ceasing and those that are changing to a different existing Freeview multiplex or changing LCN (channel number) seamlessly be reflected in the EPG.
    I have never manually re-tuned our Youview box. When there have been changes to the Freeview channel line-up in the past it has always updated its Guide automatically.
    I'll leave it alone and see how it gets on this time. :)
    @jonesch

    Can you have a quick peek above 733 on your YouView EPG and see if there is anything there?
    I had a quick peek @Roy.
    Nothing there of any interest. :p
  • joneshjonesh Member, Super User Posts: 1,655 ✭✭✭
    edited 27 June 2022, 5:54PM
    jonesh said:
    Roy said:
    jonesh said:
    zulu17 said:
    With the upcoming COM7  switchoff  is there a need to do a manual retune on any of the Youview box models or will the process be automatic and the channels that are ceasing and those that are changing to a different existing Freeview multiplex or changing LCN (channel number) seamlessly be reflected in the EPG.
    I have never manually re-tuned our Youview box. When there have been changes to the Freeview channel line-up in the past it has always updated its Guide automatically.
    I'll leave it alone and see how it gets on this time. :)
    @jonesch

    Can you have a quick peek above 733 on your YouView EPG and see if there is anything there?
    I had a quick peek @Roy.
    Nothing there of any interest. :p
    Yesterday’s quick peek piqued my curiosity, so I had another look.
    There are five channels out of position in our Youview box EPG. ITV4 is on 800 (26), E4+1 on 801(30) and three Great something or others on 802-804. I think that they are the dispossessed remnants of a 60 channel number change that took place last January.
    https://www.cordbusters.co.uk/freeview-reshuffle-60-channels-changing/
    I will do a manual retune if they are still out of position after the upcoming Freeview channel changes. I think that they will be.
    Why did it get 55 channels right and five wrong?
    That’s the peak of my curiosity. :)
  • DarrenDarren Member, Super User Posts: 639 ✭✭
    edited 27 June 2022, 10:29PM
    @jonesh @Roy I noticed this on my sisters 55inch Samsung 4k smart tv. That she had some channels in the 800s. She no longer has Youview and just uses the tuner on the TV and also has an Amazon Firestick 4k plugged in to her TV.
    I been staying at hers over the weekend will she's been away and also watching her doggies. She stays just over 3 miles south from me and gets her TV signal from Craigkelly transmitter.
    I also get my TV signal from Craigkelly. Just over 12 miles east from me but depending on where in town you stay, some TV aerials point towards Blackhill 27 miles west from me.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,520 ✭✭✭
    edited 28 June 2022, 6:58AM
    jonesh said:
    jonesh said:
    Roy said:
    jonesh said:
    zulu17 said:
    With the upcoming COM7  switchoff  is there a need to do a manual retune on any of the Youview box models or will the process be automatic and the channels that are ceasing and those that are changing to a different existing Freeview multiplex or changing LCN (channel number) seamlessly be reflected in the EPG.
    I have never manually re-tuned our Youview box. When there have been changes to the Freeview channel line-up in the past it has always updated its Guide automatically.
    I'll leave it alone and see how it gets on this time. :)
    @jonesch

    Can you have a quick peek above 733 on your YouView EPG and see if there is anything there?
    I had a quick peek @Roy.
    Nothing there of any interest. :p
    Yesterday’s quick peek piqued my curiosity, so I had another look.
    There are five channels out of position in our Youview box EPG. ITV4 is on 800 (26), E4+1 on 801(30) and three Great something or others on 802-804. I think that they are the dispossessed remnants of a 60 channel number change that took place last January.
    https://www.cordbusters.co.uk/freeview-reshuffle-60-channels-changing/
    I will do a manual retune if they are still out of position after the upcoming Freeview channel changes. I think that they will be.
    Why did it get 55 channels right and five wrong?
    That’s the peak of my curiosity. :)
    @jonesh

    So your EPG hasn’t got anything at 26 or 30, nor wherever the GREAT! channels should live? Or are there the correct programmes there, or ‘wrong’ programmes there?

    Or does the EPG say one thing, but when you select the channel it is something else?

    Normally, the 790 and upward channels are placeholders for channels undergoing reassignment, though I did have a legitimate other-region ITV at 800 where we used to live.

    And in Spain, all the tuned channels on our T1000 were stored at 800 upwards, the YouView box vaguely recognising their otherness.

    I have no idea why there are only five channels out of place; it may even go back to changes before the latest 60 were asked to budge up.

    Or maybe @Stephen has an algorithm to share with us? 💻

    Either way, I would be inclined to do a retune now, see if everything sorts itself out as it should, and then the consequences of not doing a manual retune tomorrow and Thursday will be rather clearer.

    Finally, on the p-theme, and for @Darren:-

    https://www.countryliving.com/uk/wildlife/pets/a38168930/dog-tv-launches-uk/

    We don’t, alas, get DogTV on YouView, but if we did, I’m sure it would be Peke viewing time 😛
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • joneshjonesh Member, Super User Posts: 1,655 ✭✭✭
    I retuned the box.
    The channels on 800-804 have moved to their correct numbers, which were previously vacant. All channels above 733 have disappeared.
    I won't do a retune tomorrow or on Wednesday, to see if it gets it right.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,520 ✭✭✭
    edited 28 June 2022, 10:42PM
    jonesh said:
    I retuned the box.
    The channels on 800-804 have moved to their correct numbers, which were previously vacant. All channels above 733 have disappeared.
    I won't do a retune tomorrow or on Wednesday, to see if it gets it right.
    @jonesh

    Great, that all exactly bears out my observation that while YouView boxes are very good at following channel changes (as yours got 55 right), they aren’t perfect (as yours got 5 wrong).

    It will be good to see where yours ends up after tomorrow and Thursday.

    (YouView boxes are better than we are at knowing what day it is 😛)
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • joneshjonesh Member, Super User Posts: 1,655 ✭✭✭
    Roy said:
    jonesh said:
    I retuned the box.
    The channels on 800-804 have moved to their correct numbers, which were previously vacant. All channels above 733 have disappeared.
    I won't do a retune tomorrow or on Wednesday, to see if it gets it right.
    @jonesh

    Great, that all exactly bears out my observation that while YouView boxes are very good at following channel changes (as yours got 55 right), they aren’t perfect (as yours got 5 wrong).

    It will be good to see where yours ends up after tomorrow and Thursday.

    (YouView boxes are better than we are at knowing what day it is 😛)
    I didn't say which Wednesday. :|
  • DarrenDarren Member, Super User Posts: 639 ✭✭
    Have had to do a retune of both my Yoview boxes a short time again when I got in from work but all seem ok.
    Not good that Freeview has lost more HD channels yet again.
  • John LJohn L Member, Super User Posts: 888 ✭✭
    Darren said:
    Have had to do a retune of both my Yoview boxes a short time again when I got in from work but all seem ok.
    Not good that Freeview has lost more HD channels yet again.
    It's been a "major drama" in our home trying to encourage elderly mother to simply turn over to Freesat pvr for missing HD channels or other option of using iPlayer. She won't do it/"too complicated"/too many menus to access etc. So she will only watch in SD now on BBC News channel. SD picture as we all know/also in my opinon totally unsharp/washed out/soft picture, never mind my eye sight!

    Freeview are totally unfair with regards anyone not good with technology. Just glad I have option of using other tvs around home. I wonder what is next happening on the Freeview horizon? I know they want to broadcast via internet. Hopefully Freesat will add more channels to their line up. John L
    Can't wait for the day when Youview get rid of the dreaded darkened banner when using fast forward/rewind recordings. 
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,520 ✭✭✭
    edited 30 June 2022, 9:58PM
    Darren said:
    Have had to do a retune of both my Yoview boxes a short time again when I got in from work but all seem ok.
    Not good that Freeview has lost more HD channels yet again.
    I did a retune of my LG GX at the TV’s prompting, and a retune of a YouView box at @Louise Murdoch’s prompting.

    I didn’t look to see what, if anything, was anomalous first, but both came back with a 794 channel requesting a retune. The LG put 794 between 699 and 700, I think because it differentiates TV programmes from radio programmes, though the YouView box put it after 733, the highest radio programme, so in sequence.

    Both devices have now gained 106 BBC Four HD, which we have never had here before, as our TV provider, who relays Rowridge to our estate, could not pull it in for us.

    A powerful force (SWMBO watching Wimbledon)  has prevented a second retune.

    [Edit: The powerful force having moved into the room with the Samsung TV, I retuned YouView and the TV, and 794 CBS Drama is still ‘there’, on both, as a message saying it is now RealityXtra, so some glitch at Freeview, no doubt. Possibly because I can’t get RealityXtra, which it did warn might be the case.

    I also had a message on the YouView box from BT to say that no retune would be necessary either day. But I’m with Louise on this one.

    On my Samsung TV, I have three anomalous channels, 790 Together TV, 800 BBC Four HD, and 801 CBeebies HD. These last two are services we never had before, as above. No idea about 790. Another new channel, waiting to move into place?]

    I will report the results of retuning when the powerful force, who has now moved into the room with this TV, moves out of it again.

    [Edit 2: The Samsung, retuned, now matches the other TVS; just the anomalous 794]
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • John LJohn L Member, Super User Posts: 888 ✭✭
    Hi @roy, I read somewhere that BBC4 HD is going to be moved to another multiplex & then it will be available again. Good news in some ways, but I miss QVC HD & also BBC News HD. At least they are available (if you want them in HD) on Freesat. Oh what fun! John L

    P.S. hope you are able to regain control when the powerful force has left the room! 
    Can't wait for the day when Youview get rid of the dreaded darkened banner when using fast forward/rewind recordings. 
  • DarrenDarren Member, Super User Posts: 639 ✭✭
    edited 30 June 2022, 8:14PM
    John L said:
    Hi @roy, I read somewhere that BBC4 HD is going to be moved to another multiplex & then it will be available again. Good news in some ways, but I miss QVC HD & also BBC News HD. At least they are available (if you want them in HD) on Freesat. Oh what fun! John L

    P.S. hope you are able to regain control when the powerful force has left the room! 
    I will miss BBC News HD as for watching it in HD on iPlayer will not be the some.
    I will also sort of miss QVC HD as well as Quest HD.
    You can really tell the difference in picture quality when watching QVC SD than the old QVC HD that's now gone from Freeview.
    Quest SD picture quality is ok but not the same when you have gotten used to watch it in HD.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,520 ✭✭✭
    edited 30 June 2022, 9:53PM
    @John L

    Your aged parent (©️ Charles Dickens) is in the vast majority. The biggest single obstacle to the takeup of HD TV is the BBC Regional News being in SD, so people can’t just put 101 on and stay with it all day. Even just showing London regional news in HD would be preferable to those half-hours of static display with a weird cacophony of sound behind them, but no, they can’t even do that.

    The second largest issue is that HD is on 101 upwards. You may recall that LCNs 1-24 are so prized that when the BBC want another channel, BBC 3 or the like, everybody has to budge up to make room for it, and one poor channel gets booted out. But you then have to go through three times as many LCNs as that before you get to what should be the crown jewels of Freeview, the HD channels. It does not make a lick of sense.

    Why aren’t Freeview pushing for a setup where if you put any SD channel on, and the programme you are watching is available in HD, it seamlessly shows you that instead?

    Come to that, why don’t YouView do this? They aren’t bound by the Freeview rules, and they have the technology to detect when programmes are or aren’t on HD as well as SD.

    People know in their hearts that HD is better, but as you say, Freeview are totally unfair with regards to anybody not good with technology, so they can’t get their heads beyond the point where SD is easier.

    If YouView did this, it would give them a new and unbeatable USP, and maybe a new lease of life. And I’m pretty sure this is something @Stephen could knock up at least a demo of in his den over a weekend 😛

    So how about it?
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,293 ✭✭✭
    Its already been done, twice. Both failed. I loved the HD trials from all the services but none of them worked. Click 001 or 101? The majority, even though they now own a HD TV, just click 1.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,520 ✭✭✭
    edited 1 July 2022, 8:03AM
    Visionman said:
    Its already been done, twice. Both failed. I loved the HD trials from all the services but none of them worked. Click 001 or 101? The majority, even though they now own a HD TV, just click 1.
    @Visionman

    What I envisage is users still click ‘1’, but the service provides ‘101’ where that is available. But you are saying this has already been tried twice?

    So:-
    Done twice by whom? 
    Does it include YouView - I’m not aware of any such?
    Do you have any references to these I can chase up?
    Do you know why they failed?
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • redchizredchiz Member, Super User Posts: 5,433 ✭✭✭
    Is it not a simple matter that Freeview are forever losing airwaves to mobile data courtesy of Ofcom, rather than anything "unfair?" 
  • kodikidkodikid Member Posts: 1,044 ✭✭
    edited 1 July 2022, 2:22PM
    And there's a reason for that.

    Television is moving more and more to being  Internet based. 

    Just purchased a qled set for the spare room, this room has no tv aerial, all the input comes from my stream bar.

    As for watching the terrestrial offerings   
    ( itself a increasingly rare experience)

    They're all available on iPlayer all4  etc. 


    OK I cannot watch the local news on the beeb but I'll live. 

    I can even indulge in BBC 4 and news in HD something that's no longer possible on terrestrial.

    Deacon Blue hit from October 88
  • DarrenDarren Member, Super User Posts: 639 ✭✭
    I still watch some of the Freeview channels but I have to say in well over the last 2 years almost 85% of my monthly TV viewing has been via the streaming services payed for as well as some of the free ones.
    Watching via normal TV is slowly decreasing but I would say normal TV will still be around for at lest the next 10 or 12 years.
  • RoyRoy Member, Super User Posts: 17,520 ✭✭✭
    edited 1 July 2022, 3:54PM
    kodikid said:

    OK I cannot watch the local news on the beeb but I'll live. 

    I can even indulge in BBC 4 and news in HD something that's no longer possible on terrestrial.
    @kodikid

    If you mean what I think you mean, then:-

    BBC iPlayer/Settings/Settings & Help/Other Settings/Change Location

    You will probably see the default location of London initially, but if you choose your location as above, depending on where you are exactly, you will henceforth get any local programmes available, including the local news, on your BBC iPlayer.

    BBC NEWS HD, yes, but as for BBC Four HD, this has just appeared on 106 for the first time since we moved here, albeit it’s just a placeholder at the moment. 

    So I’m not sure why iVe got it and you’ve lost it, unless they gave me yours 😛
    ‘Have nothing in your houses that you do not know to be useful, or believe to be beautiful’ Wm Morris
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,293 ✭✭✭
    redchiz said:
    Is it not a simple matter that Freeview are forever losing airwaves to mobile data courtesy of Ofcom, rather than anything "unfair?" 

    OFCOM are merely an extension of the Government and they sold off Freeview's spectrum because they wanted the cash, which at the time was worth a small fortune. Its the internet where it will all end up.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
  • redchizredchiz Member, Super User Posts: 5,433 ✭✭✭
    Visionman said:

    OFCOM are merely an extension of the Government and they sold off Freeview's spectrum because they wanted the cash, which at the time was worth a small fortune. Its the internet where it will all end up.
    Yeah, I'm aware of all that, I was just trying to offer a brief explanation to those who were crying "unfair" which I found an odd reaction. Just my personal view. 
  • VisionmanVisionman Member, Super User Posts: 10,293 ✭✭✭
    Hi @Roy, and no, I can't answer any of your questions apart from one - Why did it fail? I've already answered that. It's because the majority of people aren't bothered about HD. They just want to watch TV. Though recent OFCOM stats suggest SD/HD viewing is now 50/50 which is a big increase over what it was.
    I'm now happy with the disagree icon, because its gone.
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